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there was a shooting today at a highschool just a few miles down the road from me in Knoxville Tennessee. we are not known for that type of violence usually, but it does occur. a 16 year old boy shot another kid apparently. why are kids so troubled these days?! if you pray, please pray for the boy that died.
nate

Kids cant control their anger nowadays and its partly because parents dont discipline like they use to.

Dude, pray for the boy who died but also pray for the kid who shot him to learn his lesson. That's how it works.

Amen, Solo. Kids don't know discipline or morals anymore. It's all about me, me, me, and right now. They want everything for themselves and only focus on, you know, school, not getting involved or at least pondering events and aspects of life that are beyond the single human.
One reason is the lack of discipline from parents, but another thing is our current society. Yes, the fact that most families fall apart and/or don't operate well. I mean, the last generation (I mean the parents who are 40's or so) got married for no reason, and never really understood the commitment that marriage requirements. Most importantly, they don't know how to parent. Now, not all parents of this generation are bad - my parents are awesome - but it's because these parents know their stuff.
The other reason is that our society, ever since the end of World War II, has become particularly consumerist. It was all about buy everything now! This "now" ideal also influenced marriage to a fairly large degree. So kids these days have experienced only this economic ideal, so that's the one that affects how they act. Friggin' capitalist pigs!
The reason I'm not like that is because my parents taught me well. Plus it was because I am Orthodox Christian. Now I'm not saying that just because I'm Orthodox Christian means I'm a good person. It's just that a more strict faith from a younger age will make you understand that it's more about now. But also there's a lot of Russian blood in my veins, and I'm sure you know how Russians are.
But that's the thing; in America - since it was mostly populated by Puritans in the early days - is fascinated by Christianity. If you're a Christian, people think you're a good person. Well, lemme tell you: there's a HUUUGE difference between Orthodox and Catholicism. Orthodoxy - particularly Russian - is a lot more strict than Catholicism. When we fast, it's not just on Fridays, and we don't decide what we give up. We give up dairy, meat, and entertainment for all seven days of each week for a total of 40 days. Now, it doesn't have to be painfully strict; the Church says that destroying your body is not the name of the game. It's limiting your intake and focusing on prayer. (Actually, my mom learned from her biochemistry book that a deficiency in cheese and meat can lead to leukemia! Someone we know in another parish got leukemia, and we know them as strict fasters. Weird, huh?)
Now, I'm no Catholic, so I don't want to get too deep in dissing them, but THEY'RE THE HERETICS! Heheh, but seriously, everyone thinks the Catholics were the original, but...well that's just plain illogical when you analyze it. Catholic. Catholic means "worldwide", but Christianity was far from worldwide before Rome became Christian. Plus, Catholicism experienced quite a few changes, and then they stuck with what they had and anyone who wanted to change it was deemed a heretic. The Orthodox stuck with what Christ told them, and didn't change it much, if at all.

Oops. I ranted. I even started talking about religion!
*ahem* So, anyway, school shootings are irritating because:
1. Each school shooting pisses me off a little more because it shows what idiots kids are these days.
2. It makes you even more hesitant to go to school, thinking that maybe some crazy noob might kill you and your friends.
3. Jack Thompson is going to link this tragedy to the latest video game that came out. Those friggin' lawyers are always trying to profit on misery.

I will make no comment about Anubis's rant on religion because that usually leads to debate...

(Now, I'm no Catholic, so I don't want to get too deep in dissing them, but THEY'RE THE HERETICS!"  Shit like this, I mean.  Very ignorant of you, dude.)

... And that's something I can't be getting involved with now that I've got so much damn homework...

Now, about the shooting, call me inhuman, insensitive, a bad person, or whatever, but I simply don't care about anyone who I don't know.  I'm sorry, but how can I?  Though, that's not to say that I wouldn't pray for him, because I will if I remember to do so.  Anyways, if you are to pray for him, I'd suggest that you pray for both their families and the shooter first.  That other kid's dead -- He's lived his life, and there's nothing anyone can do for him now.  (Unless you're a Mormon and believe that you CAN do something for them, in which case, feel free.)

"I'd suggest that you pray for both their families and the shooter first"

Whoops, sorry, I meant "also," not "first."

while it is the lounge, lets not turn this thread into a religious bash thread. lets keep it on the topic please. the boy who died didnt deserve it, no matter what his life was like. he was only like 15/16 years old. too young to die.

as for you zero, you can easily feel for people you dont know. empathy is a human quality that you can develope over time. hardship in your own life tends to help you understand the pain and suffering of those you dont know.
nate

Sure, it can be done.  I could feel bad for this kid, but I don't.  Its not really my fault.  Ever heard of Stan "Tookie" Williams?  I feel bad for what happened to that guy. 

He was the founder of the "Crips" gang, and was later sent to prison.  He changed his ways and started writing books and stuff, trying to make up for all of the bad crap he did.  He was one of the few people that prison actually changed, he had a revelation!... And what happened to him?  Well, he had the death penalty and was denied clemency, so they killed him.  I feel bad for 'em.  I think they made a movie about him too.

SOrry to hear about the kid who died.

But nothin beats discipline like an ol spanking lol

Not sure about that, October. I don't own a gun and I only know a few people that do, but I don't see how gun laws are helpful. It's really easy to illegally purchase a gun - I'd be surprised if every teen didn't know someone that knew how to get a firearm. The criminals all have them - I don't see why law-abiding citizens can't.

This argument is so hilarious - I see Michael Moore's fat ass parading around with pseudo-liberal propaganda and it makes me want to assassinate him - but I don't. Why? Because I have a certain mechanism in my brain which prevents it, not to mention my fear of earthly law enforcement putting me in a prison.

Whether or not I have guns, I don't go killing people. Whether or not I have drugs, I don't do them.

Basically, my point is that banning things accomplishes nothing. In countries where there are strict gun laws and there's not much gun violence? I seriously doubt it has to do with the laws. There's something different about those cultures which precludes a need for banning anything, because the people there grow up not having the mechanism.

I just briefly glanced at this post - shooting seem pretty common nowadays. Most arguments fall around "parents' fault, they don't discipline their kids." I'm not sure what that's supposed to mean. I'm 34 and a lot of my friends weren't disciplined, if by that, anyone means spanked, slapped, taught how to act in society. I wasn't either. Yet I didn't go kill everyone in the school, and trust me - if anyone was going to kill everyone, it was me.

So that brings me to wonder what actually has changed? I get no solid answers. Rise of technology, perhaps social isolation amidst seemingly non-isolation, such as online forums, pms, voicemails, texts, Skype, etc. People like that have lots of "friends" they've never met.

But that's too simple and I can't think of any psychiatric reason why someone would start killing. I like Occam's razor - simplest is best - maybe ever since one person thought it was cool to gun down, other teens think it's cool to gun down. I figure I won't underestimate teen's need to be "cool," be it by shooting, drinking, smoking pot, or being mean.

Maybe our society has de-evolved to where instead of bullying, the bullies now just start killing. And since guns don't require strength, bullies can be anyone with access to a firearm? Nah.

Anyone that can figure out this answer(s) will probably win the Nobel Peace Prize.

I'd have to agree with Madglee, I mean I do think that Parents should be responsible for their children and that they playe a large part in who their child becomes but I really don't think that if a kid shoots another kid people should start pointing fingers at the parents.

Maybe it is technology or violence in movies like you said but even if we lived in the happiest world ever and every parent was near perfect I think that kids showing violence would still be at least somewhat common.  I want to say it's hormones or just being a teenager but even ignoring it a child can have a born mental problem that isn't easy to see.  Or can have anger build up until one day he/she snaps

And yeah finding those answers are totally Nobel Peace Prize worthy.

Goddammit, you people think I'm some Conquistador hellbent with converting all Catholics here to Orthodoxy. So I started to rant. Fine! Geez, sorry if it makes you feel better. Of course atheists can get away with it... whatever.

And I agree with most things people are saying. madglee is right.

My belief: it is the parents job to teach children right from wrong and the consquences that result from both actions, if the parents have failed to this, then i believe it is the parents fault, if the parents did teach their children this to the best of their abilities, then that means the child knew the consquences and knew that he was choosing wrong over right and therefore i would not blame the parents.

btw i onyl read madglees reply and skipped the rest of the thread, sorry if someone already brought this up.

I disagree. You say that it's about the "best of their abilities".  If their abilities suck, they're still going to suck and it's still their fault. At least in my opinion

If their abilities suck then maybe they werent meant to have children and that means that its still their fault. but there is no such thing as a perfect parent, or person for that matter, adn thats why i said best of their abilities, in the end it doesnt really matter who is to blame, what matters is what can be learned to prevent it from happening again. whether or not its the child or the parents fault, prevention must come from both sides. The onus is on the parents to teach their child right adn wrong, and the onus is on teh child to stick to their morals and etc.

ive noticed that shootings and lockdowns in high schools are becomign quite frequent now. the biggest scare in canada was at a community/local college in montreal a few years back, and the news went on for days about the attackers life story basically, they showed his blog and how he was into guns and that he wrote that he wanted to kill people etc. School is suppose to be a safe place, and so many security measures are taken to prevent outsiders from entering the school but it seems like the threat are the students themselves nowadays...

The threats have always been the students themselves. Never have you seen random strangers busting into a school to kill for no motive other than killing. And saying that they "weren't meant to have children," while I totally agree, actually, is completely unethical. We may as well put quotas on people saying that if your genetics aren't good enough, you can't have kids. Or, if you don't make enough money, you can't have kids. Or two kids. Or three kids, depending on income. I'm actually all for that, but that is horribly unethical and immoral and raises questions like, "What genetics are good enough?" and "Should everyone be genetically tested?" We may as well all be in Huxley's "Brave New World" at that point.

Haha! no i didnt mean it based on any objective evidence. Although income and demographics do strongly influence crime rate (obviously) it would not be something that I would personally say affects whether you should be a parent or not. and of course its unethical.

Well, according to Jack Thompson, violent video games are the cause of it all... pfft! HA HA HA HA! If that were always true, I would have been a serial killer by now.