Hey guys!  I’ve finished solo playtesting my new game, and am at the stage where I need feedback from others in order to tighten it further.  Is anyone available for beta reading a game?

This game is an open-map dungeon exploration RPG.  It includes item and stat based combat, an armor system, a spellcasting system, secret rooms and compartments, traps, and more.  It has 11 victory epilogues; 1 default epilogue, and 10 that can be unlocked through certain actions during gameplay.

CLICK HERE TO PLAY

Now, I understand that we here at CYS shudder at the thought of actually reading games.  I’m trying to get around this by bribing people:  If you’re willing to help me out with playtesting, I’ll post a thoughtful review on 3 games (or a single 7 or 8 length game) of your choice (can be yours or someone else’s), or help you beta read your own game.  I’m flexible on bribery options, so if you can think of something else you need help with I’m happy to help.  You’ll also get a shoutout in this game once it’s published.

If you want to help me playtest:  Play through the game to one of the epilogues 2-11, and then answer the questions commented below.  Epilogue 1 can be reached without a very involved gameplay, so it’s not a very accurate indicator of finishing the game.

IF YOU WANT TO HELP BUT DON’T HAVE THE TIME to do a full playtest, just playing through once casually and commenting your “playtest scores” in this thread would be incredibly helpful.  Once you finish the game, you’ll be given a list of playtest scores at the bottom of the final page, so just highlight the text and copy-paste it in this thread.  This would help me a ton.

NOTE:  Uh, yeah, I realize this is a lot of questions.  A one-sentence answer will do for most of them, though, so… hey, where are you going?

 

Anyone who plays the game through to one of the non-default epilogues (2-11) and answers these questions will receive 3 thoughtful reviews on the games of their choice (or one review on a 7 or 8 length game).  Alternatively, I can help you playtest/edit/beta read a game of your own, or work out some other form of bribery if none of the options here interest you.  You’ll also get a shoutout in the published game.

 

Please post your “playtest scores” here:  Once you finish the game, you’ll get a block of “playtest scores” on the bottom of the last page, which I’d like you to copy-paste here.  This is really important so I can figure out what people are actually doing in the game, how easy certain epilogues and events are to trigger, and it will help me weigh your answers against your gameplay so I can see if your comments apply generally, or are specific to your gameplay experience.

General Questions:

1) Do you think this game belongs in the fantasy or puzzle/game category?  I’m not sure myself, since it has elements of both.  Where would you go if you were looking for a game like this?  From an attention-garnering perspective I’m also not sure; puzzle/games is less popular, but fantasy is more competitive.

2) Does this game’s diffculty rating of 5/8 and maturity rating of 4/8 seem accurate?

3) Any suggestions on a title?  The only one I can think of is “Kicking Down the Door”, but it seems kind of bland.

4) What do you think of the game’s description?

5) How would you rate this on CYS’s 8-point scale?  Why that rating?  What would you change about the game to increase your rating?

Resource questions:

1) Did you feel you had access to enough health potions quickly enough?  There are a number of health potions/healing options scattered throughout the dungeon, but it might take the player some time to find them.  If finding health potions is too difficult early in the game, let me know, and I’ll make them more accessible.

2) Did you feel you had access to enough mana?  Obviously characters with low mental scores won’t have much mana, but characters with 12 or more mana points should not feel constantly strapped for resources.  There are a couple potions in the dungeon that replenish mana specifically.

3) At any time, did you attempt to use an item or spell in a logical way but were unable to?  I’m trying to make all logical uses of items and spells doable in gameplay.  If you list all the places where you tried to use and item/spell but were unable to, I’ll go back and add in an effect for the item/spell in that area.

4) Anything else about resources you’d like to add?  Did you have enough armor?  Or was your armor too powerful and nothing could hurt you?  Did you have enough weapons?  Etc.

Combat:

1) Did combats seem too long or too short?  I can easily change combat length by adjusting player and monster health totals, so this would not be difficult to fix.

2) Did you feel combat provided you with options using a wide variety of skills?  I was really trying to avoid classic text adventure point-and-click combat by including a variety of options that affected how combat played out.  Did I succeed at making combat more entertaining?  How come?

3) What combat strategy did you use?  Did you switch up what weapon you were using a lot?  Did you just use one weapon and “slash” until it was over?  Did you use a lot of spells?  Did you change up your options a lot trying to access unique attacks?

4) Anything else about combat you’d like to add?

Spellcasting:

1) Was finding and learning spells too much effort, or just enough of a challenge?  I want spellcasting to be accessible enough and useful enough that some people will choose to specialize in it, but difficult enough to access that not everyone will, depending on their mental scores.

2) Was finding spell components too hard?  Did it make spellcasting not worth the effort?  I can make them more accessible if so.

3) In what way did you use duration-based spells?  Were they easy to use and understand?  Did they seem overpriced for their duration?

4) Did you use spells in combat?  If so, how?  Did it seem appropriately helpful?

5) Anything else about spellcasting you’d like to add?

Exploration:

1) Were the dungeon secrets too hard or too easy to find?  Bear in mind high or low intellect and perception scores will impact what you find.

2) Did the amount of the dungeon you had time to explore seem fair?  The game is designed for the player to be able to explore most, but not all, of the dungeon in one playthrough, and still have enough health left to survive the endgame sequence.

Endings:

1) Did the endgame sequence add to the game?  Did it seem like a good capstone, or just unnecessary?

2) Which endings did you find?  Which was your favorite?  What did you think of them?  Did they seem too easy or too hard to get?  Was there enough variation between them?

3) Would you say this game has good replay value?  Would you play it more than once?

General:

1) Was the dungeon layout easy to follow?  Hopefully the pictures helped with this.  Does the game need more map images?

2) Were the rules easy to understand and was the game easy to understand without reading the rules?

3) What was your favorite/least favorite aspect of gameplay?  Combat?  Exploration?  Spellcasting?

4) Should there be more replay options?  I’m considering adding a replay option, where you reenter the dungeon after getting one of the endings.  You’d keep your stats and items, and there would be a “class ability” added to each of the endings 2-11, which will appear in your inventory when you replay the game.  For example, mages would get some new spells and mana, the enchanted lute for bards would be ungraded to be useful in combat or for healing purposes, necromancers would get some kind of necromantic spells, paladins would get a healing ability of some kind, etc.

5) Did you run into any bugs or typos?  I’ve played through this game multiple times to all the endings to scan for errors, but I’m sure it’s possible I missed some.

6) Any other comments/feedback about the game?  Anything you can tell me helps a ton!

Playtest Scores:

Score(7104)

Strength(-1), Constitution(-1), Precision(1), Agility(-1), Charisma(1), Will(-1), Intellect(3), Perception(3), Health(13 / 28), Mana(78 / 100)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(74 / 145), Mage(28 / 140), Ranger(12 / 45), Bard(120 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

Arrak(2), Thoed(0), Daiel(0), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

Fireball(0), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(1), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(3)

Investigate(34), Dagger(3)

Orcish(2), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(44 / 52)

HEALTH is 13.

Thanks a ton for doing this, it's very helpful!  Do you have any idea how you ended up with a mana maximum of 100?  It's supposed to start between 3 and 21, and though there are a couple ways to increase it in-game, I didn't intend for it to ever get as high as 100, which suggests to me I made a coding error somewhere.  Did you start the game with 100 mana or did you gain that amount at some point during the game?

Thanks again for your help.

Oh whoops, I think I started at 21, but it ended up being 100 along the way. I hadn't really looked at my stats all that much, so I have never noticed it.

After going through the game, I found out where the issue was and it should be fixed now.  I had coded in a place that gave you 100 mana so I could test out a bunch of spells, and just forgot to remove it, but it's gone now.  Thanks for finding that, lol!

Whew. Sixth time is the charm (I did nothing but exit as soon as I started):

Playtest Scores:

Score(1000)

Strength(-1), Constitution(1), Precision(1), Agility(-1), Charisma(1), Will(1), Intellect(3), Perception(-1), Health(6 / 32), Mana(15 / 15)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(1 / 145), Mage(0 / 140), Ranger(0 / 45), Bard(10 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

Arrak(0), Thoed(0), Daiel(0), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

Fireball(0), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)

Investigate(1), Dagger(0)

Orcish(0), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(1 / 52)

HEALTH is 6.

GENERAL QUESTIONS

1) Well, it kind of looks like Berkezerka's dungeon stompage if you look at the game design and coding. I have the odd feeling that in terms of complexity your game will easily overtopple it if you publish it. So... I would put it in the fantasy category purely because of that reason.

2) NO, fuck no. 5/8 difficulty does not describe the amounts of pain I had to go through during my entire playthrough. There are so many things to keep track of like health, mana, where I'm going etc. A 5/8 difficulty would probably be a game with some stats and delayed consequences for your decisions, not a whole puzzle dungeon crawler ordeal. I would give it a 8/8 or 7/8 difficulty. Maturity seems fine by me.

3) Haha Dungeon Busters or Dungeon delvers perhaps? You can also choose something related to the mythology of your fantasy world. Ehh, or adventurer's beginning/start/advance to call back that it is probably your first mission. Don't think too much about it.

4) It's a good description! It's short enough that I was bothered to read it, so all is good.

RESOURCE

I was initially going for a mage build, but it was extremely difficult to survive without repeatedly save scumming the whole time. So some of my answers might have been a little less useful. 

1) Ehh, I was save scumming a lot during my combat encounters. Whenever I was taking damage I just pressed the "go back" button. So I wasn't that bothered by the lack of potions.

2) More than enough, but I think the greatest hurdle I had was finding an opportunity to use my spells. You see, by the time I had gathered 5 or more weapons or so, my gathered spells were mostly supportive ones. So for pretty much three quarters of the game I was mostly using physical attacks. My mana capacity therefore was never a limiting factor.

3) There was one time I actually got a little frustrated. I got a spell that lets you go through walls and stuff and somewhere in the game, near the entrance gate, there was a huge crack in the north side. I thought that I had to use that spell to slip through the cracks to reach the other side, but it didn't work. 

4) I had more than enough weapons and armor! No problem here!

COMBAT

1) Combat length is just right. 

3) no not really. Perhaps the griffon in the big circular platform room; I used a bow in that one. For most of the game, my character was so weak that I couldn't use most of the weapons anyway, so I settled for a sword. I mostly spammed slash haha.

4) Well, since there was only one way to get rid off the cursed sword and finding that store is kind of a pain in the ass (perhaps there was a second way that I don't know of), it would be really nice if that cursed sword is removed from the game. The cursed shoes weren't that bothersome as there were two ways to remove them. I also feel that stealth is not really rewarded or choosing the "smarter" options like throwing sand in the bandit's eyes or hiding behind that rock. I felt that the best way to advance is just to attack. The dodge or flee option seems to be kind of useless.

SPELLCASTING

 1)it is kind of odd, because I couldn't find any spells for the greatest portion of the game even though I was kinda aiming for that build. By the time spellcasting was an option, I found it too costly to use in regular combat due to the limited amount of ingredient, not really because of my mana (I guess I only used the offensive spells on the bandits at the end of the story). I think that it should be just a smidge easier; make it that you can find a couple spells in the beginning. Uhm, perhaps the game would run better if the mana cost of the spell would be too high for someone not specialized in it, but that it would be just right and pretty useful for someond with a high mana count.

2) Yeah, it's a little too hard sometimes. The oddest thing is, is that I couldn't use many of the spells, because I didn't have the components, but I had also no clue where to find them. I also couldn't buy them anywhere. The only thing I knew I could gather were fish scales and the bones. At some point, after wandering around doing other things, I accidentally got 100 components for some of my spells. I still have no clue why that happened. 

3) I used Arrak's spell a lot, because it was free. The other spells not so much, because I haven't found many good opportunities to use it. 

4) yes, during the bandit fight. Sursprisingly very helpful in fact. It was the psychic attack and the arcane ward.

5) In which locations do you use the spell keen eyesight actually? Blink too. I have no clue.

EXPLORATION

1) were there secrets? I did have a high perception and intelligence, but the only thing I found were the god shrine things and the Arrak ceremony and the existence of orcs, goblins and other creatures.

2) oh it was plenty. It was so much that I actually got lost despite using a darn paper map. One thing: is it on purpose that these dungeon doors make you teleport to entire new places. When I was drawing out the map: I came across the rat room in two opposite areas. I was so confused for a moment. I initially planned to explore the entire dungeon, but my poor navigation skills caused me to give up seeking out every nook and cranny of the dungeon. What you said, made sense in hindsight now that I think of it.

(P.S. the man, mouse, wife, 5 number riddle, you made me do math grrrr... yet I still have no clue what the answer is.)

ENDINGS 

1) oh it felt nice to read, it felt like a good cut off point though I wonder why there was an option to sell all your stuff at the end. I was almost afraid that there was a second dungeon I had to explore haha.

2) the first one I came across was the Golden cup ending, where you drink one of them in the secret room and pass out.

The other endings I got were: epilogue 1, 2, 5 and 7. My favourite is probably the bard and the Blood warrior one. It seems like a natural progression to me as I did have a magical lute and a flute in my possession and have participated in that weird Arrak ritual. There was enough variety to me.

3) well, I already played it more than once, and there were still things that left me suprised or parts I hadn't fully explored. So it has a gokd replay value in my opinion. The game and the map in general is just massive.

GENERAL

1) No, not really, but I normally have a lot of difficulties with map based games and navigation. 

NORTH, SOUTH, EAST, WEST make sense when you traverse through rooms, but they end up being extremely confusing when I go through hallways, eapecially when there are passages where there are two corridors at the west side. At some point I swallowed down my laziness and had to draw out my own map to navigate around the dungeon. Still, there were certain paths where I had no clue where I had come from. I can send you a few pictures about which of those locations I am talking about. I think that a map that slowly expands like in Dungeon stompage would help, but that would be a pain in the ass to code. Otherwise, I think that you could use colored dots to show the player where you actually come from when you walk through corridors. You can perhaps also use colors to make it easier to show which hallway or corridor you're talking about.

2) most things are very intuitive, but I did had to specifically look up how spells work and where you could learn spells and such. The physical combat could be learnt without reading the rulebook a single time, but magic and spells are a little bit more difficult to get it right the first time, same could be said with knowing what each of your stats actually do.

3) favorite: the exploration despite my previous complaints about navigation. There were so many cool things to be found like the gambling den, the various shrines and such. It was honestly pretty fun. I think that my most favorite pages were those of you interacting with the dungeon's inhabitants, playing chess, buying stuff, participating in weird rituals. The more cinematic parts were realy fun to read.

Least favorite: the spells/combat. It was kind of soothingly mind numbing at times, but it was largely me save scumming so that my squishy wizard wielding a cursed sword doesn't die within 4 clicks. I think that I would have a better time with a more warrior oriented build.

4) oHhh, that would be pretty cool!! I wouldn't mind that really. It would however be a little troublesome if the "end game and leave comment" option was removed and is accessibale only by completing the second run.  I do wonder if it would not balloon this enormous game out of proportion for you haha, it would probably be a lot of extra work.

5) not that I could think of. There was one place where it said "go west", but instead you went "east", but I couldn't remember which place anymore. I think that I have to do another run to find out where that exact location is. As for typos, it's all clean to me.

6) it's frankly amazing Gryphon. It was probably a true headache to code all this stuff in (I noticed that the room titles change when you have visited it before just like in the ruins of Anzar). This game really satisfied my urges to play another dungeon crawler for the upcoming few months haha, it had basically anything I can ask for. I think that it will be a real gem if it got published. Oh yeah, and I found the time weaver shrine!!!

Conclusion: It's an awesome game and more people should playtest it. 

As for the bribery material: hmm... I will be satisfied with a step by step walkthrough of the ruins of Anzar the moment the player gets to the forbidden city. I was still stuck there the last time I checked. But of course you don't have to do that!!! I'm already happy for being one of the first ones to play it!!

Thanks a ton for taking the time to do this!

-Got it, I'll change the difficulty to 7/8 or 8/8 (I'll wait for a bit more feedback from others before picking which one).

-Hmm, with your high mental scores you should have easily done well as a mage.  If you struggled with that, it's probably a game balance issue, and I'll work on making spellcasting more accessible.  It sounds like the main issue was finding components; I can work on making components more accessible in a wider variety of locations.

-Argh, yeah, the phasing/blink spells should totally work there but it will be an utter pain to code.  Thanks for pointing that out, I'll work on it.

-There is a second way to get rid of the cursed sword, but I may add a third if it turns out to be very annoying.

-Your agility score was pretty bad, so I'm not too worried about the stealth-based combat options not working out for you.

-Got it, I'll try and make spells/components more accessible earlier on.

-The keen eyesight spell was duration-based, so it just provided you with a general stat bonus (to perception and precision).  The blink spell could be used to escape an attack during most combats, and was useful in a few other places, like to escape the bowl during the harpy fight.

-There were a number of secret rooms (at least one of which I know you found), and several hidden features and puzzles in rooms which you can find with the investigate item.

-Yes, there is one set of rooms that teleports you to a different area.  This is meant to be just an added challenge, but if people think it's more confusing than puzzling I might take it out.

-The option to sell stuff at the end was just to let you maximize your copper score.

-Okay, good, that's a good amount of endings for a playthrough of your length.

-Hmm.  I'll give map interactivity options some thought, but you're right, that would be REALLY hard to code.

-Yeah, if I do add extra options they will be optional and won't replace the endgame link.

-Awesome, I'm glad you enjoyed the game!

 

The main thing it sounds like I need to change is making specializing in spellcasting more accessible, because you did have the right stat build for it.  Three quick questions:

1) Did you find the library, and if so, how much time did you spend in it?

2) Did you find the vampire's old secret room?

3) Did you unlock the stock room near the entrance hall?

 

Thanks again for doing this, it's incredibly helpful!  Which 3 games (or one 7 or 8 length game) do you want me to review?

1) in my first playthrough I did find it (I guess 10 clicks?), but I didn't in my second (the one you're seeing now). 

2) nope (or do you mean the one with the casket and the ghoul)

3) yup!

@Darius_Conwright

For whatever reason, I didn't see your bribery request until just now.  By when the player arrives at the city, do you mean the city exterior after finding Keriz's camp, or the temple interior after solving the lens puzzle?  Also would you rather I pm this to you or post it in a parlor room thread?

Hope you don't mind if I throw some random comments around:

I found the door (just east, to the north). I investigated it and found there was a needle trap. So I tried to pick the lock, avoiding the trap. The next page said, "Try to pick the lock on the door
You stop your efforts at picking the lock and pull your hand back--this door lock has a needle trap on it.

Nevertheless, with a very careful hand, you find you're able to disarm the trap and open the lock. You grin to yourself as you open the door--that really was an impressive bit of lockpicking."

Is it odd that I stopped my efforts and noticed the trap again?

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Is it weird that you have a ton of equipment but none of it is equipped when you start? I actually read the rules, and didn't see a note about that. Maybe during setup it should force you to that page?

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It was nice to have the equipment to sell at the goblin guy. Would have been kind of pointless if I found him and couldn't really interact with him.

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Ack! I found a page titled, "BLANK" with content of "This is a new page" No links. It was when I searched through the ooze on a page titled, "Root through the ooze for loot"

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The cursed item was fun but slightly annoying that it was something I started with... Whoa. Getting rid of curses is damn expensive!

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I was fighting a statue and a page told me, "You knock the warg back with your sword."

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Ok, I became a bard:

Playtest Scores:
Score(5202)
Strength(1), Constitution(1), Precision(3), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(1), Intellect(-1), Perception(1), Health(16 / 32), Mana(4 / 6)
Adventurer(1), Rogue(61 / 145), Mage(7 / 140), Ranger(34 / 45), Bard(90 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)
Arrak(1), Thoed(0), Daiel(1), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)
Fireball(0), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(1), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)
Investigate(46), Dagger(2)
Orcish(0), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)
Completion(32 / 52)
HEALTH is 16.

I'll keep trying and get to the questions after another attempt. Fun stuff overall, though!

-Got it, I'll fix the wording on the needle trap, that does sound clunky.  EDIT:  Fixed.

-Agh, that's an error; the "get items" link was just for my use during playtesting.  It's gone now, you're not supposed to start with any equipment.

-Got it, I'll get rid of the blank page in the ooze section.  EDIT:  Fixed.

-The cursed item won't be one you start with anymore, so hopefully that fixes it.

-Got it, I'll fix the text in the statue combat.  EDIT:  Fixed.

 

Thanks a ton for doing this, glad you're enjoying it!

Found another bug!!

When you go to the shrine of Daiel, and use the shining sword, you somehow triggger a fight with an ogre with a health bar of 100!

The same thing happens in the moss room after you choose to investigate and then choose to use a spell.

Hmm, thanks for catching that!  That didn't happen to me when I tried it, so I think what happened is for one of the combats, I forgot to take the game out of "combat mode".  After a combat ends, the foe's life is automatically set to 100, and while in combat mode, using any offensive weapon or spell takes you back to that combat.

Which monster were you fighting against?  If you tell me that, I can go back and make sure the game exits combat mode after its fight.  The game doesn't have a fight with an ogre in it, so it must have been something else.  Was it the warg or orcs maybe?

Whoops they were orcs. When you use magic, they were spouting that it is dishonorable to use magic. 

Hmm, weird.  I know which fight that is, but I can't find the bug.  I did a few things that MIGHT have fixed it, so I guess I'll just look again if it happens to anyone else.  Thanks for finding that.

Hmm, I tried it again, it seems to be fixed.

One question, is it correct that in the treasure room of the moss room, the south door cannot be opened with an unlock spell?

Yeah, since it's a one way door and doesn't have a keyhole, it can't be opened from that side.

Forgive me by constantly spamming the forum like this, but I finally found the confusing hallway I was talking about!! Both hallways kinda lead to the south, so the phrasing was kinda confusing to me.

Could the description perhaps be changed to something like this? Westernmost hallway and easternmost hallway

Sure, I can make the link descriptions clearer there.  Forum spamming is not annoying at all and much appreciated!

EDIT:  Link descriptions changed

Weird: I killed the ghoul. I investigated and found the indentation. I couldn’t get past it. I left it alone. Then I could open the tomb again and fight the ghoul again

I cast a fortitude spell and a rage, but I wasn’t strong enough to use an axe? I couldn’t check my stats because I was in combat. It is possible that using those items in combat makes them not work? After combat my str was -3. Does the rage penalty to str last forever? I cast fortitude and my str went from -3 to -1. I cast it in a later battle and it was -3 after the battle.

I was fighting an ooze. I hit it with my last fire arrow. It did damage. I tried to shoot it again. I had no arrows left. It told me I had no arrows left. Then when I returned to the page, it applied the damage from last round again.

In the beetle room, I could play instruments over and over again and it always rewarded me with the treasure flute. It never incremented the number of treasure flutes, but it let me play repeatedly and kept saying I got another treasure flute.

I got a book and a necromantic tome, but could never read them, it always said I could not use that here. I'm guessing there’s somewhere I’m allowed to use them, but I never figured out where.

When fighting the warg, it told me many times that I cried out in pain from the attack, but I never lost any health.

There were some times when the convert 1 health to 2 mana was dim – and I had 30/32 health and 9/20 mana.

In the Store room, when I try and use my Stats it says I cannot because I’m in combat. Oh wait. It appears the orc in the hallway locked me into combat mode, I’m stuck (until the next combat?)

Did the donations at shrines do anything? If they did, I could never tell what effect it had.

In the “Inspect the Armor” page: after I’ve taken the gem, the option to take it again is dim, but it still appears?

Played for quite a longer time this time. I had lots of options at the end: adventurer, rogue, mage, ranger, bard, necromancer, and follower of Arrak.

Playtest Scores:
Score(6328)
Strength(-3), Constitution(1), Precision(1), Agility(-1), Charisma(1), Will(-1), Intellect(1), Perception(3), Health(26 / 32), Mana(4 / 20)
Adventurer(1), Rogue(110 / 145), Mage(98 / 140), Ranger(46 / 45), Bard(270 / 160), Necromancer(24 / 10)
Arrak(2), Thoed(0), Daiel(0), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)
Fireball(3), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(4), Arcane Ward(1), Spider Climb(1), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)
Bones(9), Crystal(0), Fan(1), Fish scales(1), Fire beetle glands(0), Glass(1), Keys(2), Moss(0), Moth(0), Shadow scale(0), Ash(0), Webs(0), Coffee(2), Gem dust(0), Honey(2), Ooze(0), Scorpion poison(1)
Investigate(65), Dagger(6)
Orcish(6), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)
Completion(44 / 52)
HEALTH is 26.

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On to the questions!

General Questions:
1) Do you think this game belongs in the fantasy or puzzle/game category?
I think you already decided, but yes, for me this is clearly fantasy and nothing to do with puzzles.

2) Does this game’s diffculty rating of 5/8 and maturity rating of 4/8 seem accurate?
Yeah, I could see a 7 for difficulty. Maturity of 4 seems okay since death scenes aren’t graphic or anything.

3) Any suggestions on a title? The only one I can think of is “Kicking Down the Door”, but it seems kind of bland.
Dungeon Crawl seems reasonable

4) What do you think of the game’s description?
Works for me

5) How would you rate this on CYS’s 8-point scale? Why that rating? What would you change about the game to increase your rating?
I think I’d go with a seven or eight. It was a lot of fun.

Resource questions:
1) Did you feel you had access to enough health potions quickly enough?
It was close, but yes, I had enough. It took me a bit to take a chance with the “alternative” healing potion… but that made all the difference.

2) Did you feel you had access to enough mana?
I did, but mostly because the spells I cast didn’t seem to do anything. I couldn’t find a use for some of them, and those I could use I couldn’t see the effects of them. I did have to recharge mana once with health, then drink a pile of health potions, which seemed weird. Would it be too weird to have the orc potion randomly heal mana or health?

3) At any time, did you attempt to use an item or spell in a logical way but were unable to?
Phasing – never found a use for it. Arcane Ward – used it once, but couldn’t tell if it worked. Keen eyesight – never figured out where to use it. I caught a pile of fish, but never figured out how to scale them.

4) Anything else about resources you’d like to add? Did you have enough armor? Or was your armor too powerful and nothing could hurt you? Did you have enough weapons? Etc.
Never really saw how the armor weight hurt me.

Combat:
1) Did combats seem too long or too short?
Felt good.

2) Did you feel combat provided you with options using a wide variety of skills?
I’m not sure. This time through, I had no strength, so my combat options were limited. Once I found the fireball spell, that was fun until I ran out of ash. So it felt like I had options, but I couldn’t use many of them – maybe that’s because I was trying to be a mage.

3) What combat strategy did you use?
When I had arrows, I used those, since I had precision. I threw spears when I was out of arrows. I used fireball when I had the ash.

Spellcasting:
1) Was finding and learning spells too much effort, or just enough of a challenge?
The learning seemed painful. If I didn’t have a ton of mana, learning used so much that I didn’t have much left to actually use the spells.

2) Was finding spell components too hard?
I often had many components.. but not always the right type!

3) In what way did you use duration-based spells? Were they easy to use and understand?
I tried, but I could not tell if they worked or how they worked. Was concentration supposed to wear off after a battle? Since I couldn’t see the stats during a battle, I couldn’t see what they were doing.

4) Did you use spells in combat?
Mostly just fireball. I learned Arcane Ward only right before I exited.

5) Anything else about spellcasting you’d like to add?
It feels like it had a lot of potential, but I couldn’t always tell what was working and what effects were happening.

Exploration:
1) Were the dungeon secrets too hard or too easy to find?
Since I don’t know what I didn’t see, I don’t know.

2) Did the amount of the dungeon you had time to explore seem fair?
I feel like this time (on my 10th time or so through) I explored most of it. The first few times it took me more, but that feels right for a game like this.

Endings:
1) Did the endgame sequence add to the game? Did it seem like a good capstone, or just unnecessary?
Dunno yet.

2) Which endings did you find?
I listed all the ones I found. I don’t know what would need to be done for the others. For example, I have no clue on paladin. Is that one single event? Is that something I could work towards? I cannot tell.

3) Would you say this game has good replay value?
I’ve played about 10 times, so…

General:
1) Was the dungeon layout easy to follow?
Yes. There was one or two places where it wasn’t 100% obvious, but all good.

2) Were the rules easy to understand and was the game easy to understand without reading the rules?
Yes. The rules helped, but I didn’t absolutely need them.

3) What was your favorite/least favorite aspect of gameplay? Combat? Exploration? Spellcasting?
I liked learning the spellcasting, but by the time I really learned a lot, it felt like the game was over.

4) Should there be more replay options? I’m considering adding a replay option, where you reenter the dungeon after getting one of the endings. You’d keep your stats and items, and there would be a “class ability” added to each of the endings 2-11, which will appear in your inventory when you replay the game. For example, mages would get some new spells and mana, the enchanted lute for bards would be ungraded to be useful in combat or for healing purposes, necromancers would get some kind of necromantic spells, paladins would get a healing ability of some kind, etc.
Sounds like a ton of work, but also maybe some fun times!

5) Did you run into any bugs or typos? I’ve played through this game multiple times to all the endings to scan for errors, but I’m sure it’s possible I missed some.
I think I’ve listed what I saw.

6) Any other comments/feedback about the game? Anything you can tell me helps a ton!
Loads of fun!

Thanks a ton for doing this!  It's very helpful.  Which 3 games do you want me to review?

Thanks for finding all these bugs!

-Argh, that ghoul battle has had more bugs than the rest of the battles combined.  Should be fixed now.

-Yeah, I checked, and there was a typo in the part of the game that brought your strength back to normal after using the forititude spell.  Should be fixed now, sorry about that.

-Duration-based spells don't stack, so you wouldn't have been able to use rage and fortitude at the same time.  If your strength was originally -1 and your will was -1, after casting fortitude, it would become 1, since fortitude adds 3 + will to your strength.  1 strength isn't enough to use the axe.  After using rage, it would have triggered the bug that lowered your strength, so you still would've been unable to use the axe.

-Double-damage arrow bug is now fixed.

-You should now only be able to get the text finding the flute once.

-The necromantic tome can't be used in the game, but every time you try unsuccessfully to use it, the game keeps track of it.  If you try to use it at least twice, you unlock the necromancer ending.  I'm a little unsure about the fairness of this method for unlocking the ending; it's meant to track how invested the player is in using the book, but seems a little overly complex.  I'm considering changing it so that, like the magical theory book, using the tome takes you to a page where you can re-read the passage (and also goes towards giving you the necromancer ending).  Alternatively, there is one place in the game it could potentially be used I could code into the game, if that would be better.

-The generic book can be used in a specific place.

-If you have a high block and low dodge score (like from wearing heavy armor) that will probably happen fairly often; it basically means you took a semi-painful flesh wound but your armor protected you from actual injury.

-There's a spell that gives you extra temporary health points, so allowing the player to convert mana while using it would create an infinite mana glitch.  I decided to solve that by making it impossible to convert mana while concentrating on a spell, but if that's annoying, I can make it so that mana conversion is impossible only with that specific spell and still works normally when you're concentrating on something else.

-I couldn't find the root of the issue that got you stuck in battle mode in the orc hallway, so I just slapped commands taking you out of battle mode around that area, which should fix the issue.

-Donating money to the shrines does not have an effect.  There are two specific items that can be left as donations at two of the shrines that go towards unlocking endings.  For a couple of the gods, if you steal money from their shrine you can't unlock their ending.

-Gem link now disappears.

-Looks like you unlocked all the endings that can be found in a single playthrough (once you unlock one god's ending you can't get the others).  Congrats!

 

NOTE:  Looking at which components you picked up and which ones you didn't, it looks like you found almost all of the components the game gives to you, and very few of the ones that need to be collected from the environment with the dagger or the glass vials.  Do you think I need to make it more obvious when components are collectable from the environment or dead monsters?  I added a line to the dagger's description about this.

 

-Would making the player's eight major stats visible in the "Stats" item's description help with seeing duration-based spell's effects?  That way the player could check them during combat.

-There are a couple potions that heal mana instead of health in the dungeon, so I'll probably stick with keeping them seperate.  

-The phasing spell can be used as an escape-combat-free card in most combats, and to access several secret rooms (such as the ones in the ghoul room and moss room).  Arcane ward increases your armor stat.  Keen eyesight is duration-based and increases your perception and precision scores.

-To scale the fish, you need to "use" the fish, which takes you to a page on which you can use the dagger.  This wasn't meant to be hard to find; do I need to make this process more obvious in the fish's item description?

-Yeah, it seems like the mage option is still a little underpowered compared to the other classes.  I'll work on making components more availible.

-You can collect more ash for fireball spells by going to the fire-trapped chest room after triggering the trap and using an empty glass vial to collect the ash.

-Would decreasing the cost of learning a spell from 2 mana to 1 mana help?

-Would making the player's stats visible in the "Stats" item's description help with seeing duration-based spell's effects?  That way the player could see their stats during battle sequences.  Most of the duration-based spells wear off after 10 clicks (about the length of 1 battle).  They should also list what effect they'll have in the item's description, and on the "manage scrolls" page.

-You've found all the endings except for four of the god-based ones.  For two of those endings, you need to leave a specific item at that god's shrine as an offering, which will give you a "blessing" from that god similar to the Rage spell, and can be used similarly to unlock the ending.  For one, you need to find an item hidden at that god's shrine and use it at a specific time.  For the other, you need to take a specific action at that god's shrine, which will give you a similar "blessing".  Paladin is probably the most difficult ending to unlock, because once you "commit" to a god the other god's endings are locked out, and you can't unlock the Paladin ending until you've already entered the endgame sequence.

-Any suggestions on making spellcasting more accessible earlier in the game?  My plan is to make finding components a bit easier, and make the description hint at the harvestability of environmental components a bit more obviously.  Would including a list of the total components in the game help?  That way the olayer could see what they might eventually need and be more mindful of harvesting it when they're in that area.

-Glad you enjoyed it!

 

Again, thanks a ton for taking the time to do this, it's incredibly helpful.

Some hopefully helpful additional answers:

-Looks like you unlocked all the endings that can be found in a single playthrough (once you unlock one god's ending you can't get the others). Congrats!

Yay! I wouldn’t want them all to be easy, just perhaps a hint or two that they exist so I know to look for them. For example, if you hadn’t mentioned the paladin ending in this thread, I’d have no idea to look for it. Sure, some completely hidden things are super cool, but it might be nice to know about other options so I could keep playing until I find them! Of course, maybe in these threads IS the right place to mention those, I don’t know.

Do you think I need to make it more obvious when components are collectable from the environment or dead monsters? I added a line to the dagger's description about this.

No, that’s probably enough, I’m just stupid. I never did figure out how to get crap from the moths, but I’m sure that’s just me being confused!

-Would making the player's eight major stats visible in the "Stats" item's description help with seeing duration-based spell's effects? That way the player could check them during combat.

I think that would be very useful – or even when you cast a spell, it actually shows the increase and total (the spell increased your strength 2 points, your strength is now 3!).

-The phasing spell can be used as an escape-combat-free card in most combats, and to access several secret rooms (such as the ones in the ghoul room and moss room).

Interesting. I’ll play around more with that. Honestly, I almost never tried to escape combats since I thought the point of the game was to kill things and find treasure. Heck, I attacked the statue that I couldn’t hurt with everything I had because I wanted to kill it rather than escape.

-To scale the fish, you need to "use" the fish, which takes you to a page on which you can use the dagger. This wasn't meant to be hard to find; do I need to make this process more obvious in the fish's item description?

I did use the fish, but I missed using the dagger on the next page. That’s me again.

-Would decreasing the cost of learning a spell from 2 mana to 1 mana help?

Tough to say for sure, but especially earlier in the game it would be nice.

-Would making the player's stats visible in the "Stats" item's description help with seeing duration-based spell's effects? That way the player could see their stats during battle sequences. Most of the duration-based spells wear off after 10 clicks (about the length of 1 battle). They should also list what effect they'll have in the item's description, and on the "manage scrolls" page.

Yes, I think that would be nice because I could never tell for sure when a spell was on or off and never saw results in my stats for a spell.

-You've found all the endings except for four of the god-based ones. For two of those endings, you need to leave a specific item at that god's shrine as an offering, which will give you a "blessing" from that god similar to the Rage spell, and can be used similarly to unlock the ending. For one, you need to find an item hidden at that god's shrine and use it at a specific time. For the other, you need to take a specific action at that god's shrine, which will give you a similar "blessing". Paladin is probably the most difficult ending to unlock, because once you "commit" to a god the other god's endings are locked out, and you can't unlock the Paladin ending until you've already entered the endgame sequence.

Nice! I actually tried using the necromantic book at the one altar and was surprised it did nothing.

-Any suggestions on making spellcasting more accessible earlier in the game? My plan is to make finding components a bit easier, and make the description hint at the harvestability of environmental components a bit more obviously. Would including a list of the total components in the game help? That way the olayer could see what they might eventually need and be more mindful of harvesting it when they're in that area.

I don’t know if a total list of components would be too obvious?

-Glad you enjoyed it!

Absolutely! Thanks for taking so much to build this crazy thing!

-The best way to catch the moths is with the spear.  You can also catch them with the longbow, but it's harder.

-Got it, the stats are now visible in the stats item's description.

-Showing the change to stats on the spell effect page is a really good idea, duration-based spells now do that.

-Yeah, escaping combat is really only important if you're very low on health.  Do you think having armor penalize agiliy in general would be a better trade off, as agility is also used for other things?

-Yeah, the statue can't be hurt by ordinary weapons.  You can kill it with the stone to flesh spell, though, and it drops one of the more valuable treasures.

-If it was Morrivik's alter you tried to use the necromantic tome at, I'm strongly considering having that do something.

-Alright, I'll wait for a bit more feedback before deciding whether or not to give the player a total list of components.  Once you get a spell, it tells you what components it needs in its description, so that may be enough.

Thanks again for doing this!

I dont think a complete list of components is truly necessary, since as you noted the spells tell you what you need, and once you have some there is a list under manage spells and components.

However, perhaps consider a listing or clue as to the types of spells available.   I would not have even known to look for a stone to flesh spell if it werent for the playtest scores, otherwise I would not have even considered it.  Some spells can take quite a while to find, and I went looking until I found what I needed (spent a LOT of time in the library).  If you choose to do something like this, it could be placed in the book of magical theory, which would require one to pay attention to what they read.  

I

 

Alright, I'll probably hold off on the components list for now.

The stone to flesh spell isn't found in the library; I believe it's in the secret vampire room which I don't know if you've found or not.

The sum total of stuff in the library is a bunch of spells, Thoed's shrine, the magical theory book, the necromantic tome, a tome of eldritch knowledge, the miscellaneous book, and a magic mirror.  Plus the flavor text and spider battles obviously.  If you found all the stuff there, you probably found most everything in the library.

Yes, I did finally find it in vampire room. I think I wore the library out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Playtest scores:

Succumb to your injuries
The various injuries you have received have become too much for you to continue. Your vision grows dark, and you collapse to the ground unconscious. You bleed out shortly after.


SCORE: 0

HEALTH is -1.
End Game and Leave Comments

Since you are a chad reviewer, I will definitely get around to this, at the cost of my own writing. Sometime over the next week I'll get through your story!

Great, thanks a ton!

Playtest scores:

Succumb to your injuries
The various injuries you have received have become too much for you to continue. Your vision grows dark, and you collapse to the ground unconscious. You bleed out shortly after.


SCORE: 0

HEALTH is -2.
End Game and Leave Comments

 

I’ll do a proper full playthrough before answering all the questions, but here’s a couple of minor things I picked up.

I died fighting against a ghoul I found in a tomb. I did lower its health to 0 whilst my health was still positive, but then went into another round of combat. Does enemy health need to be below 0 to defeat them?

Also, I thrust with my spear and got the text “you slash your sword”. I then tried throwing my spear at the ghoul and got “You hurl your spear at the bear”.

One other point, I noticed in the rat room there was a couple of times when a rat succesfuly attacked and sunk its teeth into my arm, but my health didn't go down.

Thanks a ton for doing this!  

Yes, at 0 health the player and monsters are still fine, health needs to go into the negatives for them to die.  If that's confusing, I can change it so 0 health also counts as dead.  The typos in the ghoul fight should be fixed now.  

It is possible for a monster to appear to deal damage but for you to not loose health, that just means your armor did a particularly good job that round and the wound wasn't injurious.  

My own opinion (and worth exactly what you paid for it): yes, when health = 0 someone is dead. I did notice that most encounters you not only have to get them to negative numbers, but then also continue one more round for them to actually die.

Sure, I'll change it so that they're dead once they hit 0, not once they drop below it.  Probably will be less annoying to the player that way.  Thanks!

EDIT:  Combats now end at 0 life instead of -1.

I seemed to have stumbled upon a link loop after studying the 'keen eyesight' scoll. It goes Study the scroll ->(return) Manage scrolls & spells ->...Stats -> (Back to game) Study the scroll 

Wait, I think I know what is the problem. When one uses the stat book thing, make sure they can't use it again while it's open, or else the saved return page would end up saving a page in the book creating a loop.

Also I think in  Rules-> Spellcasting you wrote 

Mana

You cast spells with your “mana” total.  Your maximum mana score is determined by your four mental ability scores, charisma, will, intellect and precision.  Max mana = (charisma + will + intellect + precision) x3, with negative scores counted as 0s.  You can regain expended mana, but you can’t exceed your total mana.

But the fourth mental ability score is perception. Hope this helps

You're right, it should be fixed now so that you can't access the stats while already managing them.  Thanks for catching that!

Typo also fixed, thanks again!

Good Morning,

I finished my first playthrough, and I will go back and try and obtain some of the other endings.  Please see below for scores.

 

Playtest Scores:

 

Score(1239)

 

Strength(1), Constitution(-1), Precision(3), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(3), Intellect(-1), Perception(1), Health(7 / 28), Mana(27 / 27)

 

Adventurer(1), Rogue(77 / 145), Mage(30 / 140), Ranger(1 / 45), Bard(35 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

 

Arrak(0), Thoed(0), Daiel(0), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

 

Fireball(0), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)

 

Investigate(52), Dagger(15)

 

Orcish(6), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

 

Completion(19 / 52)

 

HEALTH is 7.

I will answer these questions now after my first play, but will revisit them after several more tries.

General Questions: 

1) Do you think this game belongs in the fantasy or puzzle/game category? My opinion would be fantasy.  Although the puzzles in the game make it interesting and require thought, the puzzles are not really the central focus on the game.  It seems to be a traditional dungeon crawl adventure.

2) Does this game’s diffculty rating of 5/8 and maturity rating of 4/8 seem accurate? I think the difficulty rating should be a little higher - at least a 6.  Some of the puzzles seemed more complicated than what a 5/8 would be.  I chose to give up on some of them to keep exploring.

3) Any suggestions on a title?  No suggestions at this time

4) What do you think of the game’s description?  The description seemed good.  I knew exactly what type of game to expect when I started.

5) How would you rate this on CYS’s 8-point scale?  Why that rating?  What would you change about the game to increase your rating?  I enjoyed it so I would probably give it a 7 (I think of it now as a high 6 low 7, but of course ratings are whole numbers).  For me, It would need to be much more extensive to get an 8.

Resource questions:

1) Did you feel you had access to enough health potions quickly enough?  Yes, and no. Very early seemed to find enough. But then soon after, I was having to avoid any conflict because I did not have enough.

2) Did you feel you had access to enough mana? On first play did not use mana much.

3) At any time, did you attempt to use an item or spell in a logical way but were unable to?  Not on first play

4) Anything else about resources you’d like to add?  I should have read the instructions about managing the equipment. I had progressed a bit through the game before I figured out where to see the armor.  I knew I picked some up, but was confused when the shield didn't show up in my inventory with the weapons..

Combat:

1) Did combats seem too long or too short?  The combats seemed about right. They were challenging but not too easy.  

2) Did you feel combat provided you with options using a wide variety of skills?  I thought the variety was pretty good.  In practice I did not notice much difference between the dodge and defend, but this could be to just having one play through.

3) What combat strategy did you use?  When different attacks were available I varied them between slash, strike, or thrust, trying to see what worked best. Usually I tried some defend and dodge in the middle.

Did you switch up what weapon you were using a lot? I did not switch much during the battles.  Used different weapons at different times in the dungeon, but mostly stuck with the one capable of most damage.

Did you just use one weapon and “slash” until it was over?  At times, this seemed the most effective method.

Did you use a lot of spells? Not on first play.  I will on subsequent plays and reanswer questions.

Did you change up your options a lot trying to access unique attacks?  When available I tried the different attacks.

4) Anything else about combat you’d like to add?  Not at this time

Spellcasting:  I haven't yet tried the spellcasting.  I will revisit these questions after more play.

 

Exploration:

1) Were the dungeon secrets too hard or too easy to find? In my opinion, it seemed about right.  They shouldn't be too easy.

2) Did the amount of the dungeon you had time to explore seem fair?  So far, I would say yes.

Endings:

1) Did the endgame sequence add to the game?  Did it seem like a good capstone, or just unnecessary?   My opinion is that it definitely added and I thought it made a nice ending to the game.  I left the dungeon earlier than I could have just to experience what the end would be like, and it was nice having a choice of branch at the end as to what I would now do

2) Which endings did you find?  Which was your favorite?  What did you think of them?  Did they seem too easy or too hard to get?  Was there enough variation between them?

I only finished one play so far and got to adventurer and rogue

3) Would you say this game has good replay value?  Would you play it more than once?

I enjoy this type of game and would replay.  There is enough variation in what can be done in the dungeon that it is not simply doing all of the exact same things the same way.  Plus, I like trying to get all the different endings.

General:

1) Was the dungeon layout easy to follow?  Hopefully the pictures helped with this.  Does the game need more map images?  It was fairly easy to follow.  

2) Were the rules easy to understand and was the game easy to understand without reading the rules?

They were pretty easy to understand.  However, as noted above, without reading the rules it took me a little while to figure out where items such as armor, shields and such were going since they did not show in the viewable inventory.  At first I thought it was a bug and I wasn't really picking them up.

3) What was your favorite/least favorite aspect of gameplay?  Combat?  Exploration?  Spellcasting?  Definitely the exploration and looking for objects.  I liked that in some rooms, I had to keep searching about 10+ times to find certain items.

4) Should there be more replay options?  I’m considering adding a replay option, where you reenter the dungeon after getting one of the endings.  You’d keep your stats and items, and there would be a “class ability” added to each of the endings 2-11, which will appear in your inventory when you replay the game.  For example, mages would get some new spells and mana, the enchanted lute for bards would be ungraded to be useful in combat or for healing purposes, necromancers would get some kind of necromantic spells, paladins would get a healing ability of some kind, etc.

5) Did you run into any bugs or typos?  I’ve played through this game multiple times to all the endings to scan for errors, but I’m sure it’s possible I missed some.  

I did notice that in a couple of rooms the god's ALTAR was spelled ALTER.  Spellcheck wont find those, and I will look for the exact pages on next play.

6) Any other comments/feedback about the game?  Not at this time

Thanks a ton for doing this, I really appreciate the feedback!  Which 3 games do you want me to review?

-Dodge and defend have the same effect on attack and damage, the difference between them is the new options they open up to the player.  Defend gives attack-based and weapon-based new options, where dodge gives agility-based ones.

-Got it, I'll see if I can make the first-page rule summary a little more clear about where armor can be found.

-Got it, I'll keep an eye out for altar/alter as I read through.

Again, this is very helpful, thanks for taking the time to do this.

You are welcome.  I am enjoying going through this dungeon, so no need to pay the bribe.  But if I do publish a game or write something in the future, perhaps you could at least give it a look over. 

Below is my progress so far at unlocking the epilogues

1) Adventurer:  UNLOCKED

2) Rogue:  UNLOCKED

3) Mage:  UNLOCKED

4) Ranger:  

5) Bard:  UNLOCKED

6) Necromacer:  

7) Blood Warrior:  Step one completed

8) Student of Magic:  

9) Paladin:  Step one completed

10) Maverick:  

11) Dark Disciple:  

There was one battle of combat where I was using the Bow of Fire, but the result page was that I thrust with my spear. This happened several times.

 

Also, I have collected the mage staff several times, but it will not show up under treasures.  In one play I started completely from scratch without the freeplay. solved the puzzle and found the mage staff - it didnt enter my items and was not left in the room.

Then I cleared the rubble and went to the entrance hall, went back into the room and solved again.  Found the staff again but it still didnt enter my items and was not left in the room. 

If it cannot be picked up due to previous actions or items I am now carrying, it would be helpful if it were still there waiting like the gem in the armor.  Otherwise, it might be a bug.  I have also had this same issue with the golden flute.

 

Thanks for finding these!

-Bug with the bow of fire is fixed now.

-Mage staff should show up in your treasures now, there was a typo in the code on the "treasures" page.

-What was the issue you had with the flute?  It does not have the same problem as the staff, so I'm not sure where the issue is.

Earlier I was having the same issue with the Golden Flute that I was having with the mage staff;  I will have to go see if I can get it to do it again.

Playtest Scores:

 

Score(1503)

 

Strength(3), Constitution(1), Precision(3), Agility(4), Charisma(-1), Will(1), Intellect(-1), Perception(-1), Health(26 / 32), Mana(1 / 3)

 

Adventurer(1), Rogue(141 / 145), Mage(24 / 140), Ranger(10 / 45), Bard(65 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

 

Arrak(1), Thoed(0), Daiel(1), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

 

Fireball(2), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)

 

Investigate(66), Dagger(19)

 

Orcish(3), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

 

Completion(44 / 52)

 

General Questions:

1) Do you think this game belongs in the fantasy or puzzle/game category? Personally I think this would feel most at home in the fantasy category.

2) Does this game’s diffculty rating of 5/8 and maturity rating of 4/8 seem accurate? I'd bump up the difficulty rating a bit, but maturity feels accurate to me.

3) Any suggestions on a title?  'Penetrate Craig's Cave'

4) What do you think of the game’s description? I like it, accurate description of what to expect.

5) How would you rate this on CYS’s 8-point scale?  At the moment I'd probably go with a 7. If it was expanded on a bit more I'd go up to 8. But, that's based on one play through where I was more focused on play testing than searching for the different epilogues, so that rating may well go up with another playthrough.

Resource questions:

1) Did you feel you had access to enough health potions quickly enough?  Honestly, I didn't really feel like I needed to use many. I went full armour, so was pretty tanky.

2) Did you feel you had access to enough mana?  I had a strength build, so I used like one fire spell against a statue (which didn't work, duh) and then stuck to using melee for the rest of the game.

3) At any time, did you attempt to use an item or spell in a logical way but were unable to? N/A

4) Anything else about resources you’d like to add?  Armour did feel a bit OP. I get its weight means you can't dodge as well, but I never felt like I needed to. With plate mail and shield I was pretty invulnerable and could just tank most damage.

Combat:

1) Did combats seem too long or too short?  It seemed appropriate at the start of the game, but didn't really scale imo. By the end I had a ton of armour and magical weapons, so I'd slash a couple times and they'd be dead.

2) Did you feel combat provided you with options using a wide variety of skills?  I probably didn't go for the best build in terms of variety value, but I had a good range of weapons. Although the cursed sword kind of ruins that a bit. I'll be interested to try again using a magic or archer style character.

3) What combat strategy did you use?  One weapon and slash constantly. Again, I don't know if that's just the particular build I had this playthrough or if I would end up doing the same regardless.

4) Anything else about combat you’d like to add?

Spellcasting:

1) Was finding and learning spells too much effort, or just enough of a challenge?  I learnt one whole spell, and then didn't bother after that because I had like 3 max mana lol

2) Was finding spell components too hard? I felt like I had loads of components, but since I wasn't using spells I've no idea if they would have been enough or not.

3) In what way did you use duration-based spells? 

4) Did you use spells in combat?  

5) Anything else about spellcasting you’d like to add?

Exploration:

1) Were the dungeon secrets too hard or too easy to find?  I noticed that in this playthrough I had lower perception than my previous one where I died, and didn't notice things I had before. I feel like I did find enough secrets to keep things interesting though.

2) Did the amount of the dungeon you had time to explore seem fair?  I felt like I had enough health to explore the whole dungeon tbh. But I got lost and somehow stumbled across the entrance again so left before I'd found them all.

Endings:

1) Did the endgame sequence add to the game?  The bandits were pretty easy for me to defeat, so didn't really add much to me. I carried the wounded one back to the village, but I then couldn't tell if that changed my epilogue at all past a bit of flavour.

2) Which endings did you find?  Just got the basic adventurer one. I didn't spot any obvious way to get the more interesting ones, so I'm curious to go looking for them in a replay.

3) Would you say this game has good replay value?  I feel like exploring the dungeon could become a bit repetitive, and I'll know how to solve puzzles etc, but I think the different play styles and different epilogues add some good replayability. I definitely want to try again.

General:

1) Was the dungeon layout easy to follow?  Pictures were definitely a nice addition. Don't think there was any point where I didn't understand which way I was going.

2) Were the rules easy to understand and was the game easy to understand without reading the rules? I checked the rules once or twice to clarify things, but it was pretty easy to understand what I was doing.

3) What was your favorite/least favorite aspect of gameplay?  Spellcasting, simply because I didn't utilise it. All in all, each aspect was enjoyable imo.

4) Should there be more replay options?  I’m considering adding a replay option, where you reenter the dungeon after getting one of the endings.  You’d keep your stats and items, and there would be a “class ability” added to each of the endings 2-11, which will appear in your inventory when you replay the game.  For example, mages would get some new spells and mana, the enchanted lute for bards would be ungraded to be useful in combat or for healing purposes, necromancers would get some kind of necromantic spells, paladins would get a healing ability of some kind, etc.

I don't know if that's necessary, but I'd definitely be interested to try that out if you do end up implementing it.

5) Did you run into any bugs or typos?  I spotted a few minor ones, I'll add a separate comment underneath this one for them.

6) Any other comments/feedback about the game?  I hope ant criticisms I've mentioned here don't put you off at all, I do think this is genuinely a well written and entertaining game.

A few bugs/typos I noticed:

 

Typo when investigating the crystals with air blowing through them “faking the sound slightly fuller”.

If you go into the room with the ghoul in the tomb and investigate before opening the tomb, then the game seems to think I’ve already killed the ghoul. I was able to investigate the tomb, get the axe, go into the sanctum, and when I came out of the sanctum the ghoul’s corpse is slumped over the tomb. Although if I then leave back into the hall and then go back into the crypt again, it then attacks me.

I was somehow teleported when investigating a shrine and ended up at a different one? I was at the shrine for the spider goddess, I investigated and found a daiel candle and then was suddenly at daiels shrine by the room full of statues.

South of Gridok's waypoint, the description says there is a branch off to the east leading to a room, but it isn't there on the map or as a link.

In the final battle the double sword bandit cuts open each of ‘yoru’ arms.

I think you might have missed the bandits when changing the enemies to die at 0 instead of -1. I got the lead bandit to 0 and he survived.

 

Thanks a ton for doing this!  Which 3 games do you want me to review?

-If you had the plate mail, you certainly wouldn't need to dodge much.  I don't mind the plate armor being a little overpowered, since it's difficult to get.  You certainly had the strength and constitution scores to support a combat-focused build, so I think it's fine that combat get easy for you towards the end of the game; it should have been easier with those scores and items.

-What you do with the wounded bandit can affect the epilogues you receive, but you have to do something very specific.

-Based on your scores, it looks like you were close to qualifying for three of the other endings (epilogues 5, 7, and 9).

 

Quick question:  You ended the game with 4 agility, which is possible with certain spells, but you don't seem to have used any.  Do you know how that happened?

 

Typos:  Mostly all fixed now, thanks for pointing those out.  The ghoul sequence will be a pain, though.  And yes, in the final battle the bandits don't die until they drop below 0.  Unless people really hate it, I'm going to leave that battle the way it is, as while the other battles were easy to change for that, altering the bandit battle to have them die at 0 instead of -1 would be a major undertaking.

 

Thanks again for doing this, it's extremely helpful!

Honestly I wasn't doing this with the bribery opportunity in mind, I just had a bit of free time this weekend and decided to spend it testing other people's games rather than working on my own lol. But I might keep that those reviews open for later games I publish if thats an option.

With the agility thing I have no idea, sorry. I think my starting agility was -1, but then I didn't really pay attention to it as I was playing, and I don't recall anything happening that would have raised it. I drank a couple of the orkish drinks, but I assume they're just health potions. Found a pair of cursed boots and then lost said cursed boots, but I can't remember if they affected my agility. Left donations at a couple of shrines, I don't know if that actually has any effect on anything. Can't think of anything else I did that might have changed it otherwise.

Also, quick question (if this is explained somewhere in the rules and I missed it then sorry): does keeping any items at the end alter your likelihood of getting a different ending? e.g. keeping my shining sword would have increased chance of getting paladin? I wasn't sure so just sold everything to up my copper score.

The bandit surviving at 0 wasn't really an issue, if its a massive pain to change then I'd say its fine as it is.

Alright, I'll look into the agility thing.  I probably just put somethign that increased agility while playtesting and forgot to remove it.

Keeping only two items affect what ending you get; the mage staff gives you some more points towards the mage ending and the enchanted lute gives you more points towards the bard ending.  The paladin ending isn't point-based, it has a specific event that triggers it.

Thought I'd post a general update for those of you who have been actively helping with this (thanks again!):

 

-3/3 people said this should be in the fantasy category, so fantasy it is!

-Everyone agreed the difficulty level should be higher, so I’m changing it to 7/8 for now.

-Health potion placement seems to be balanced; some people found them easily while others took more time, and overall it seems like there’s a good distribution depending on what people’s stats were.

-Combat and armor also seems to be balanced; harder for people with worse physical scores, easier for those with good ones.

-The big issue seems to be that spellcasting is not balanced.  It takes too long for prospective mages to find the components they need to cast their spells, even when they have the right ability scores for it.  I'll be going through the game and making it easier for the player to find a wider variety of components in different places.  The overall amount of components available will not increase by much, they'll just be available in more locations.  Spell placement I'll leave alone for now as well to see if altering component placement fixes the issue.  Once I fix this, I'll probably ask if someone can give another playthrough as a mage to see if it's easier.

EDIT:  I've made some adjustments to component placement throughout the dungeon, but it's occurring to me I don't really know which components people are having a hard time finding.  As such, I'm instead adding component amounts to the playtest scores at the end of the game, and I'll wait to see which components people aren't finding before adjusting their totals.  If anyone is willing to play through again so I can see which components are being found that would be quite helpful.

For anyone curious, here's the number of people who've found each ending so far (of those who reported their scores to me):

1) Adventurer:  4

2) Rogue:  4

3) Mage:  1 (my bad, should get easier soon)

4) Ranger:  0

5) Bard:  3

6) Necromancer:  0

7) Blood Warrior:  1

8) Student of Magic:  0

9) Paladin:  0

10) Maverick:  0

11) Dark Disciple:  0

Here are the scores from my latest playtest:

Playtest Scores:

Score(6329)

Strength(1), Constitution(-1), Precision(-1), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(3), Intellect(1), Perception(3), Health(14 / 28), Mana(3 / 21)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(288 / 145), Mage(161 / 140), Ranger(33 / 45), Bard(110 / 160), Necromancer(12 / 10)

Arrak(1), Thoed(0), Daiel(1), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

Fireball(1), Phasing(1), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(1), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(1), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(1), Unlock(1), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(1), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(1), Psychic Attack(0)

Bones(6), Crystal(2), Fan(1), Fish scales(4), Fire beetle glands(3), Glass(1), Keys(1), Moss(5), Moth(0), Shadow scale(3), Ash(3), Webs(2), Coffee(1), Gem dust(0), Honey(1), Ooze(4), Scorpion poison(1)

Investigate(113), Dagger(37)

Orcish(4), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(44 / 52)

HEALTH is 14.

-----

I ran into what seems a bug in the Moth Room.  My idea was to collect some more moth wing.  The only thing in the room was the moth (and me), but when I attacked the moth suddenly I was in combat with an orc with 100 health.  After the battle, I was in the temple room having just proven myself a warrior (again).  This happened twice, I went back and it did it with the shining sword also.

Also, in the end sequence, I fought the bandits and had them all with -2 health.  However, the description has the second bandit escaping into the trees.  This was confusing as she should have been dead.

Yeah, a couple people have had that issue with the orc battle.  I can't figure out where the problem is, but I've tried patching it up more generally, and have added a number of random checkpoints throughout the dungeon that take you out of battle mode, so hopefully it won't come up again.

Enemy health is just used to track an enemy's staying power, negative means they're "defeated", not necessarily dead.

 

Looking at the components you found, I'm a little reassured since you really picked up a lot of stuff, even the things that were hard-ish to find and took effort to collect.  Out of curiosity, were you trying to do spellcasitng much on this playthrough?  It doesn't look like you cast many spells, but you certainly had the components for it.

 

Thanks again for doing this, it's very helpful!

I did not do much spellcasting on this particular playthrough.  But I have been trying to collect everything possible, and as much of it as I can get.  I have been doing spellcasting progressively on various plays to see just what works and is helpful and what isnt. this time I focussed more on specific spells to cast effectively to obtain specific objects or goals, since there is a mana cost for learning as well as casting.  Primarily I focussed my attention on spider climb, phasing, language, speed, and fortitude to obtain objects.

In combat, I have used spells sparingly and mostly just fireball. My weapons have seemed to be more effective.

True, the two combat spells (fireball and psychic attack) use charisma, which you didn't have very high.  Do you think reducing the mana cost to learn spells from 2 to 1 would make spellcasting more accessible?

Perhaps, but I think that the challenge of how to manage and balance health and mana is pretty good.  I was able to find and learn almost all of the available spells even before I obtained any sparkling potion.  Resource management is just part of the puzzle.

However, what would make me more apt to look at spells in combat vs my weapons would be if they provided an advantage vs certain enemies.  Such as fire deals extra damage vs undead. It just seemed to me on average that my weapons dealt as much if not more damage and did not cost me mana.  But overall, I felt that I was able to work out a way to get enough mana.

I finally went back and fully read how to end the game. Should have done that sooner. Might go back and playtest several different times and complete more.

Playtest Scores:

 

Score(5077)

 

Strength(-1), Constitution(1), Precision(-1), Agility(1), Charisma(-1), Will(1), Intellect(1), Perception(3), Health(0 / 32), Mana(15 / 15)

 

Adventurer(1), Rogue(26 / 145), Mage(0 / 140), Ranger(39 / 45), Bard(170 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

 

Arrak(0), Thoed(0), Daiel(0), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

 

Fireball(0), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)

 

Bones(0), Crystal(2), Fan(0), Fish scales(1), Fire beetle glands(0), Glass(1), Keys(0), Moss(0), Moth(0), Shadow scale(0), Ash(0), Webs(0), Coffee(0), Gem dust(0), Honey(0), Ooze(0), Scorpion poison(0)

 

Investigate(11), Dagger(5)

 

Orcish(0), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

 

Completion(14 / 52)

 

HEALTH is 0.

Thanks a ton for doing this, it's quite helpful!  I didn't even know you could get that high a bard score lol.

Below are my latest playtest scores.

After restarting with the Freeplay in inventory, I have been running into an issue in the Armory.  After I defeat the orcs, I get the message that I have received a Spear, Iron Shield, Orcish Drink, and Great Axe.  However, none of these seem to be picked up and placed in my possession. This has been one of the first places I go when starting in order to get some gear.   If I leave the room and come back, they are not there.

If I start completely brand new (not a restart with freeplay), it works just fine.

 

Playtest Scores:

Score(6461)

Strength(1), Constitution(-1), Precision(-1), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(3), Intellect(1), Perception(3), Health(24 / 28), Mana(26 / 26)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(305 / 145), Mage(220 / 140), Ranger(48 / 45), Bard(115 / 160), Necromancer(14 / 10)

Arrak(1), Thoed(0), Daiel(1), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

Fireball(2), Phasing(3), Stone to Flesh(5), Blink(0), Speed(1), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(1), Arcane Ward(1), Spider Climb(1), Unlock(1), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(1), Detect Magic(1), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(2), Psychic Attack(1)

Bones(7), Crystal(2), Fan(1), Fish scales(2), Fire beetle glands(2), Glass(1), Keys(1), Moss(5), Moth(1), Shadow scale(3), Ash(2), Webs(2), Coffee(1), Gem dust(0), Honey(2), Ooze(4), Scorpion poison(1)

Investigate(130), Dagger(37)

Orcish(5), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(45 / 52)

Found the issue, there was a typo in the code that reset the variable that lets you pick up those items.  Should be fixed now, thanks for finding that!

Looks like you had a fairly successful run as a mage, with tons of components and spells.  That makes me feel a little better about game balance, though it is true you're already familiar with the game layout having played multiple times.

 

General question (to you or any playtester):  Do you guys think game balance for the mage/spellcasting route has improved sufficiently?  Or do components still need to be made more accessible?  Alternatively, if playing as a mage is something the player gets better at on replays, is that acceptable?

 It is definately something that you understand better on replays. I think that is fine. People can figure it out in one run, but it may take longer. It would take the same amount of time, I think, to figure out how to work a mage first run and to replay with mage as a goal. It seems pretty balanced to me.

noooo i got rid of freeplay for myself when I logged out of my computer last night!

@Darius_Conwright @Ogre11 @DBNB @BenCrucifix @Yummyfood @Wizzycat @elad771 (I tag you all here as you've previously commented in this thread, no pressure if you're busy.  Thanks again for all the help!)  (Obviously if you weren't tagged here but do have feedback, I'd still love to hear it.)

After getting general feedback from a variety of people, consensus seems to be that the game as a whole is fairly well-balanced, with a number of one-off bugs and typos, but no major systemmic issues.

One possible exception to this is with spellcasting, which is tougher for first-time players to get the hang of, what with learning spells and finding components.  However, as people who replay the game don’t have a problem finding components and using a wide variety of spells, I’m hesitantly satisfied with having spellcasting be a somewhat more “advanced” gameplay option, one players might not necessarily explore fully on a first playthrough.  As spellcasting is useful particularly for unlocking more advanced/secret areas of the game, it makes sense that it would be more the focus of replay attempts from returning players.  What are your thoughts on this?

If you guys think that no, spellcasting should be more easily accessible to first-time players, the three possible solutions I can think of to this would be 1) Making more components available, 2) Reducing the cost to study a spell from 1 mana to 2 mana, and/or 3) Including a full list of possible components that the player can see at the start of the game.  Thoughts on these options?

 

The only other major outstanding point is that four of the game’s endings have yet to be found by anyone, and you guys have been doing some pretty intensive playthroughs (thanks again!).  Do you think these final four endings are too difficult to find?  I can share some details about the qualifications for these endings if you need more information to make a judgement on that.

I’ve altered the wording on the text surrounding one of the endings (ending 9) to make it a little more clear what needs to be done, and I’ve added another way to qualify for ending 11, so this may help.

 

Other than these two points, I think this game is moving towards being ready for publication.  Is there anything other than the two points above that you guys would suggest editing/changing prior to publication?  Or does the game just need more bug testing in general?

I might alter spell studying so that if you successfully learn the spell it costs 2, but if you don't, it only costs 1.  That would strike a decent balance.

The four remaining endings are like epilogue 7 (Blood Warrior) in that they each relate to a specific god.  In the "Ending the Game" section of the rules, I explain that there are 11 endings and go into a bit of detail about their classifications, and in the "Credits" section all the endings are listed.  Would it help to list out all 11 endings in the "ending the game" section of the rules like they are on the "credits" page?  My intention with the "freeplay" item was to help people be aware of all 11 endings, and give a bit of help with finding them, but it's true that the player doesn't get that until their second playthrough.

Endings 8 and 11 I think are both probably fine.  You have to do something very specific to get them, but it's nothing horribly obscure.  I could easily alter the flavor text slightly to make it more clear what needs to be done.

Ending 9 should be easier to find now that I've altered the wording slightly, it might have been my fault that that wasn't clear in the first place.

Ending 10 is probably the hardest to get just because there's a fair bit of chance involved.  But I'm certain someone will eventually find it, and I'm okay with that one being particularly tough.

I agree with ogre's assesement. If the other endings are all easy to find, there is less of a sense of accomplishment when you find an ending you haven't seen. I don't know if you have or haven't, but you should add a rank to the endings from the easiest to hardest, make it even more satisfying when people find it.

I also found a way to cheese the first run that I know people will use. If you enter and exit the craig right away, defeat the bandits, and end the game, you instantly get freeplay. I realize that in order to defeat the bandits you would need extrordinary luck or have to cheat with the back button every time you get into negative health, but it still works.

Replying to you both at once:

Yummyfood & DBNB:  Alright, in that case I won't worry too much about making the endings easier to find, and I'll leave spellcasting as it is.

Yummyfood:  I don't really mind if people do that.  If you know the freeplay item exists you must already be familiar with the game, and it'll be a useful shortcut for return players who want to get the freeplay item right away.

I agree that the spellcasting seems pretty balanced, and I like that certain aspects of the game are harder.  It is enjoyable to have some additonal challenge on replay.  For me, components have not been that hard to obtain. Therefore, I would not recomend changing it.  Also, the stats gives a list of components that you have, and the spells themselves let you know what you need and how much you have, so I dont think a comprehensive list is necessary.

As for the endings, I keep going back to try and get the endings 7-11.  It is good that they are hard to find.  Certain knowledge such as that they are tied to one of the gods, gives a direction towards getting them without making it too easy or obvious. Even after all the plays I have done, Im still trying to figure out exactly what needs to be done to get them. And this keeps me coming back to replay, so that is good in my opinion.

-Yeah lol, combats had that issue with being out of arrows too.  Should be fixed now.

-The curse-removing scroll would be difficult to code as an item.  You can always find it again later if you go back to the library, however, even if you've already used it to get rid of a curse.

-I looked into the cerulean scroll, and there was a cerulean spell called "Learn Lore" that I later removed from the game since it was too similar to detect magic.  I forgot to remove it from the library.  It should be gone now.

-Got it, the plain book should no longer be findable more than once.  Out of curiosity, where did you use the plain book and what happened?

-I would guess that it appearing to have 0 uses is a glitch caused by the editor's delay in processing pagetext changes to variables.  Unfortunately there's no easy way to fix this.  It's a purely visual glitch that only happens immediately after picking up the potion, however, and it doesn't affect gameplay at all, so I'm not going to go out of my way to work out a solution.

Thanks again for finding these!

Just a minor continuity note.  When I slip into the crack on the north wall, I get a glimpse into the lizard room.  However, even after I have killed the lizard and looted the chest, It shows the lizard there sleeping and alive.

Fixed now, thanks for catching that!

Finally got ending number 7:

Playtest Scores:

Score(7655)

Strength(1), Constitution(1), Precision(-1), Agility(4), Charisma(-1), Will(1), Intellect(3), Perception(1), Health(31 / 32), Mana(17 / 20)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(132 / 145), Mage(143 / 140), Ranger(18 / 45), Bard(120 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

Arrak(2), Thoed(0), Daiel(1), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

Fireball(0), Phasing(4), Stone to Flesh(5), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(1), Arcane Ward(1), Spider Climb(1), Unlock(4), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(1), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(2), Psychic Attack(0)

Bones(1), Crystal(2), Fan(1), Fish scales(5), Fire beetle glands(4), Glass(2), Keys(1), Moss(5), Moth(3), Shadow scale(3), Ash(7), Webs(3), Coffee(3), Gem dust(0), Honey(2), Ooze(1), Scorpion poison(2)

Investigate(52), Dagger(25)

Orcish(1), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(44 / 52)

Do you have any idea how your agility got up to 4?  You're the second person that's happened to, and I have no idea what's causing it.

If anyone notices their agility jumped up to 4 during their playthorugh, could you go through using the "go back" button until you find out what page it happened on?  Thanks!

Wierd, I have no idea. I think it was -1 at the start of the game.  Perhaps it is a lasting result of a spell used, I will try and keep track of the attributes as I go through.

On a restart with the Freeplay enabled, when I enter the bowl I am unable to inspect the pedastal and get the shining sword. Also, Unable to get the gem from the armor in the troll armor room.

Those two should be fixed now.  I'm pretty sure the agility glitch is not the result of a spell, as the other person it happened to didn't use any.

EDIT:  Got it, will fix the store room as well.

I will watch the attribute stats.  I also used the Rage quite a bit during that play - not sure if that affects agility at all.

Wow.  I must not have payed attention before.

On the restart with freeplay, In the Jail Room with the Skeletons - (It's title is skeleton room, but I think that is also the title of the room across from the gambling room)

I cannot access the first cell, second cell, or fourth cell. They are all dimmed out.

Third cell is ok.

 

This seems to be a recurring theme on this play.

The treasure room off the Moss room accessed by phasing

*    I am unable to Open the Chest or Inspect the bookshelf.

The hollow space works fine.

In the Sanctum (vampire room) accessed by phase from the crypt

  *   It will not let me Inspect the Desk, Inspect the Coffin, or Inspect the Cabinets. 

I can Inspect the bookshelves,

*    but on the bookshelves cannot Inspect the scrolls

 

 

Yeah, a bunch of those had "usable once" links, so I've gone back and fixed it to use resetable variables instead.  Thanks for catching those, let me know if you find any others!

So, now when I enter the Jail room, it lets me go into the cell multiple times and obtain the components.  It will let me load up on bones and keys and they just stay blue.  

 

Yup, I made a typo in the new code.  Fixed, thanks.

This one seems to still be not working. The links are dimmed out:
 

In the Sanctum (vampire room) accessed by phase from the crypt

  *   It will not let me Inspect the Desk, Inspect the Coffin, or Inspect the Cabinets. 

I can Inspect the bookshelves,

*    but on the bookshelves cannot Inspect the scrolls

Also in Lizard Room: 

I kill the lizard but the chest is dimmed out.

 

perhaps I am doing something weird to keep bumping into same issues ?

No, it's just an issue I need to fix in each place it appears, I just don't know when it appears.  I'll fix the sanctum and lizard room, thanks for pointing those out!

AGILITY BUG just bit me!
 

I just bumped into the agility bug several times in a row. I know exactly what I was doing but don't have a clue what triggered it. I got your nice warning page too so that was cool.

I was not doing anything that should have affected agility.

First time I was in the crypt.  I was attempting to cast phasing spell but did not have enough mana.  From that screen I pressed link to go to stats to add mana but received the warning page that agility went over 3. I never got to try and change health to mana, when I hit stats for some reason it jumped.

Next time was in sanctum. I was inspecting documents on bookshelf and it mentioned language that I didn't understand so I thought I might see if speak language spell would help. Received the not enough mana to cast page (because of course I only added just enough previously to cast the phasing).  This time I tried hitting the sparkling potion link from inventory and it gave me the agility warning page.

The similarity between the 2 times is that I just tried to cast without enough mana, and then I tried to add from that page instead of hitting return to the main room page.

 

I wanted to type this before I forgot the whole sequence, I am going to go try and see if I can make it happen consistently.

Fixed, thanks a ton for finding that!  For whatever reason, the "return" link on that page was adding 5 agility when it was clicked.  Should be back to normal now, thanks again!

So seems like a small glitch in the stone to flesh spell under freeplay. This might be my first attempt at this spell with freeplay enabled - I think the other times were from clean restarts.  

In the statue room the choices of the 3 people I can revive are missing and there are no links at all. Other than the page title, below is all I see.  (Also the inventory box below that)
 

Stone to flesh

As you begin casting the spell, you can feel which of the statues nearby you will be able to target with this spell.  Many of them are too old for an inexperienced caster like yourself to target, with others there seems to be nothing to transform, the occupant having 'died'.  There are three, however, that you feel reasonably confident about successfully casting the spell on.

 

HEALTH is 32.

Yup, same issue as all the other times.  Should be fixed now.

Also, in the store room, it will not let me eat a loaf of hard baked bread, or drink from one of the wine barrels

 

lol

You pick up the stone cup, and hesitantly lift it to your lips.  No point in having second thoughts now.  You throw your head back and drink its entire contents in one gulp.

 

You don't feel any different.  You're not certain anything actually happened.  You set the cup back on the table, but doing so is oddly difficult--your hand feels clumsy and stiff, and in this lighting, it looks oddly greyish.

 

Oh fuck.

 

You jump up and dash out of the room, stumbling over your stiffening legs as you do so.  You're not even sure why you're running--you can't think of anything you could do to stop this, much less anything you could do in the next thirty seconds.  None of the statues of experienced adventurers could think up a way to save themselves, and neither will you.

 

But intellectually knowing that doesn't make your efforts to escape any less desperate.

 

You jerk to a halt halfway to the statue room's door--your legs just won't move any further.  You stare in horror as your hands turn completely to stone before your eyes, followed by your arms, then your chest, then your head.

 

A wave of dizziness and confusion washes over you.  And then darkness.

 

Maybe someday some other adventurer will arrive at this dungeon and find a way to save you and the others trapped here.

 

But it won't be for a long, long time.

 

SCORE:  -2

 

HEALTH is 30.

Ha!  If you are lucky I will come by later and free you with Stone to Flesh spell.  

.... Well.. If I remember, and dont get too busy...

lol.

I have discovered that by using the plate armor, shield, and snake mask, I have become unhittable. I'm not complaining but is this supposed to be the case, or should I be taking damage?

I have not had that problem. I get beat up all the time.

Yep.  I take damage frequently just like ogre.

strange. I will try to recreate the same thing and see what happens. Here's my latest run.

Playtest Scores:

 

Score(2147)

 

Strength(3), Constitution(1), Precision(-1), Agility(4), Charisma(-1), Will(-1), Intellect(1), Perception(3), Health(30 / 32), Mana(3 / 12)

 

Adventurer(1), Rogue(78 / 145), Mage(39 / 140), Ranger(11 / 45), Bard(55 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

 

Arrak(1), Thoed(0), Daiel(1), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

 

Fireball(0), Phasing(2), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)

 

Bones(2), Crystal(2), Fan(0), Fish scales(0), Fire beetle glands(0), Glass(1), Keys(1), Moss(5), Moth(1), Shadow scale(0), Ash(0), Webs(0), Coffee(0), Gem dust(0), Honey(0), Ooze(0), Scorpion poison(0)

 

Investigate(23), Dagger(11)

 

Orcish(3), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

 

Completion(29 / 52)

Also I have not seen my name in the credits yet. Was I too late for that or am I just blind?

I might have caught another bug.  Necromancer ending and onwards have code instead of saying a percentage.

With the plate armor, shield, and snake mask, you should be very hard to hit.  Those items are tough to get, so I don't mind that being a powerful combination.  You also got an agility of 4 through a recurring glitch, so that probably had something to do with it.  Do you have any idea where you picked up the agility score of 4?  I can't figure out what's causing that, and I've looked.

If you haven't already closed the window, could you use the "go back" button to find out where you picked up the agility score of 4?

Added your name to the credits, it should be there now.  I'd forgotten it because you never filled out the specific questions thing, but I don't really need that any more, so you don't need to bother.

What do you mean by code instead of a percentage?

in freeplay it displays a code that i suspect is only supposed to show the percentage of completion i am at for those endings.

I have absolutely no clue where I picked up the agility of 4. It might have been from me grinding away at the arrak temple to see if it would do anything if I repeatedly defeated the orcs. I don't think it did, but it might have broken my agility repeatedly dodging.

This is my first time going through with freeplay enabled. The rocks that are usually blocking the western passage at the start are aready cleared. Shoud this be the case?

Yeah, there was a typo in the variable that reset the rocks.  Should be fixed on your next playthorugh.

I think I found the typo you're refering to in the freeplay item, should be fixed now, thanks for catching that!

I notice you're using the freeplay item.  Is this the same game as the one where your agility score jumped to 4?  If so, would you be willing to use the "go back" button to go back and find out when your agility score made the jump?

EDIT:  Agility bug now fixed

Now I’m getting into pretty minor bugs that I’m actually trying to produce:

If you skin the fish, and on the results screen use and item that cannot be used here, it takes you back to the fish screen and adds more scales to your inventory forever.

Ugh. And somewhere in there, playing with the fish scales found me in an infinite loop where “Back to the Game” took me to the “Skin the fish” page. “Skin the Fish” return took me to “Manage Equipment.” From there I could return to Stats, which only led me “Back to the Game.” Dang. I had a ton of spells on this playthrough…

Lol! “You can't afford to play your magic lute in the middle of a battle.”

In the snake room, you can press the button on the mural many times. It always says you get a serpent mask, but it does not appear to actually add more than one to your inventory.

Tried a few things, but was I supposed to be able to get “scale from a shadow” when or after fighting the shadow? I couldn’t find a way to do that.

Got massively stuck at Morrivik’s. I have the spell, but I don’t have enough mana to cast it. For some reason, when I use my stats, the option to convert health to mana is dimmed out. Dead end!

Sad and confused that I couldn’t use the phasing spell to get past the bars in the hallway…or to get past the bars into the third cell.

Playtest Scores:
Score(10506)
Strength(-1), Constitution(1), Precision(3), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(-1), Intellect(-1), Perception(1), Health(8 / 32), Mana(2 / 17)
Adventurer(1), Rogue(152 / 145), Mage(121 / 140), Ranger(41 / 45), Bard(140 / 160), Necromancer(13 / 10)
Arrak(1), Thoed(1), Daiel(1), Qin(2), Morrivik(0)
Fireball(4), Phasing(1), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(2), Arcane Ward(2), Spider Climb(1), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(1), Detect Magic(1), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(1), Psychic Attack(0)
Bones(6), Crystal(0), Fan(1), Fish scales(4), Fire beetle glands(1), Glass(2), Keys(2), Moss(5), Moth(3), Shadow scale(0), Ash(7), Webs(0), Coffee(3), Gem dust(0), Honey(3), Ooze(4), Scorpion poison(1)
Investigate(67), Dagger(11)
Orcish(6), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)
Completion(45 / 52)

Hey, was that line: Arrak(1), Thoed(1), Daiel(1), Qin(2), Morrivik(0) supposed to indicate available endings? Because when I had ending choices, I had the adventurer to necromancer endings, but only Qin was available otherwise (perhaps that was the intent, just confirming).

Minor detail. The undo curse spell in the library has a spelling error in it. The apostrophe for You're not cursed is between the r and e instead of the u and r.

Ha!  Thought I was bumping into a bug in the map, but the wormhole in the crystal room is quite handy!

Ogre:  Thanks a ton for pointing these out!

-Fish bug should be fixed now, lol.  That's quite an intricate bug.

-Man the stats infinite loop bug was a pain to fix, but it should be impossible to get stuck in a stats-fish-dagger loop now.  It's solvable just by clicking "go back" enough times either way.

-Got it, the serpent's mask should now be accessible only once.

-After you kill the shadow, you can use your dagger on the "Morrivik's altar" page to skin it for its scales.

-If the link to convert mana is dimmed out, it's probably because you're currently using a duration-based spell.  If you click around inside "stats" enough times, it should run out on its own.  This was done to avoid creating an infinite mana glitch with the ghostly energy spell.  I changed it so that the link to convert mana is only dim when that specific spell is in use, so this bug should at least be less likely to happen now.

-Oh lol yeah there should be some text for the phasing spell in those places.  I added it.

-Oh nice, you found ending 10!  And you did step 1 of ending 8, which is the hard half.  Yes, the line there indicates which of the 5 godly endings you've unlocked.  1 means you completed step 1, which for each of these endings involves acquiring an item of some sort, a value of 2 means that you "committed" yourself to the god by using that item a certain number of times / in a specific way.  For the 5 godly endings, only one can be available at a time, as they each involve "committing" yourself to the god in some way.

 

Yummyfood:  Got it, thanks for pointing that out!

 

DBNB:  Yup, I was worried people might mistake that for a bug, but hopefully there's enough hints about it that it's clear what the crystal actually does.

By this point I've memorized most of the map lol. The warp room really threw me off at first.

latest score

Playtest Scores:

 

Score(3174)

 

Strength(3), Constitution(1), Precision(-1), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(-1), Intellect(1), Perception(3), Health(26 / 32), Mana(7 / 27)

 

Adventurer(1), Rogue(73 / 145), Mage(89 / 140), Ranger(30 / 45), Bard(90 / 160), Necromancer(11 / 10)

 

Arrak(1), Thoed(0), Daiel(1), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

 

Fireball(0), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(2), Psychic Attack(0)

 

Bones(4), Crystal(2), Fan(0), Fish scales(1), Fire beetle glands(3), Glass(1), Keys(0), Moss(5), Moth(0), Shadow scale(0), Ash(0), Webs(1), Coffee(0), Gem dust(0), Honey(0), Ooze(2), Scorpion poison(0)

 

Investigate(18), Dagger(13)

 

Orcish(3), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

 

Completion(37 / 52)

 

HEALTH is 26.

 

Is there another place besides the bear room where you can get honey?

You can also pick up honey in the secret vampire room (if you've found that)

Yes, I shoulda figured it out earlier.   I've been just noticing it accidentally until this last play through.

But I had saved my game this morning and just re-opened it up.  And I noticed my agility was at 5.  It wont let me go back past the save so there might still be some agility issue in there somewhere.  This play through I have been using the dice. But I can't go back to where it jumped.

Hmm.  I'm going to assume that this is probably just because you had a saved game that hasn't recalibrate yet, as I did fix AN agility issue, but if you do notice your agility jumping above 3 again, telling me where it happened would be very useful.

Playtest Scores:

Score(10371)

Strength(-1), Constitution(3), Precision(-1), Agility(5), Charisma(-1), Will(1), Intellect(3), Perception(1), Health(22 / 36), Mana(5 / 20)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(140 / 145), Mage(133 / 140), Ranger(42 / 45), Bard(100 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

Arrak(0), Thoed(0), Daiel(0), Qin(2), Morrivik(0)

Fireball(0), Phasing(3), Stone to Flesh(1), Blink(0), Speed(1), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(1), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(1), Unlock(1), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(1), Invisibility(1), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)

Bones(6), Crystal(2), Fan(1), Fish scales(4), Fire beetle glands(4), Glass(2), Keys(1), Moss(5), Moth(0), Shadow scale(2), Ash(8), Webs(6), Coffee(2), Gem dust(0), Honey(3), Ooze(0), Scorpion poison(1)

Investigate(30), Dagger(23)

Orcish(2), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(40 / 52)

HEALTH is 22.

maverick ending?

Yes, I only have 8 and 11 left to get them all!

woot! Found the Paladin ending

Had an idea that I  hadn't quite done yet, so did a quick run to get an ending.  I have tried several variations of this over the past several tries but finally got it at the right time.
 

Now I just need endings 8 and 11

 

Playtest Scores:

 

Score(9109)

Strength(-1), Constitution(3), Precision(-1), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(1), Intellect(3), Perception(1), Health(31 / 36), Mana(15 / 15)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(32 / 145), Mage(0 / 140), Ranger(18 / 45), Bard(20 / 160), Necromancer(0 / 10)

Arrak(0), Thoed(0), Daiel(2), Qin(0), Morrivik(0)

Fireball(0), Phasing(0), Stone to Flesh(0), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(0), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(0), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(0)

Bones(0), Crystal(0), Fan(0), Fish scales(0), Fire beetle glands(0), Glass(2), Keys(1), Moss(5), Moth(0), Shadow scale(0), Ash(0), Webs(6), Coffee(0), Gem dust(0), Honey(1), Ooze(0), Scorpion poison(0)

Investigate(7), Dagger(3)

Orcish(2), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(15 / 52)

HEALTH is 31

 If the link to convert mana is dimmed out, it's probably because you're currently using a duration-based spell.  If you click around inside "stats" enough times, it should run out on its own.

I haven't played the game, but wouldn't this discourage checking the stats page while you have a duration-based spell active? Perhaps links inside the stats page shouldn't count towards the spell duration.

Since duration-based spells are useful mostly during combat (or for one-off events), I made the Stats page inaccessible during combat.  Unfortunately, the code for duration-based spells uses the global page script, which can't be limited to specific links.

@Darius_Conwright @Ogre11 @DBNB @BenCrucifix @Yummyfood @Wizzycat @elad771 (Again, I'm just tagging everyone who's posted in this thread.  If you want me to stop tagging you, let me know.)

Consensus after yesterday's update seems to be that spellcasting is balanced enough as it is, and the fact that it's more complex than creating a fighter-type build just encourages replay.  Great!

You guys also seem to agree that it's okay if some endings are harder to find than others, and as people have now found the Maverick and Paladin endings and one has done the hard part of finding the Student of Magic ending, I think I'm comfortable with the accessibility of the game's various endings.  I believe endings 8, and 11 have not been found by anyone yet.

 

With these major points mostly resolved, I'm moving towards thinking about publication timing.  Do you guys think this game is ready to be published?  Is there anything else that needs to be done first?

My one concern is that people have continued to find bugs.  I obviously want to publish this with no bugs, or at least as few as possible.  Based on the frequency with which you've been encountering bugs as playtesters, to what extent do you think this game would benefit from more extensive bug testing?  Is this a one-more-runthrough thing, a three-day thing, or an at-least-a-week thing?

 

Finally, on to the bribery payments.  Darius, you requested a walkthrough of Ruins of Anzar, which I'm happy to write up.  Do you want me to PM this to you, or post a thread in the parlor room?

Ogre, DBNB, BenCricifix, and Yummyfood:  You guys all qualify for the 3 reviews/beta testing I offered, if you're interested, just tell me the game titles and I'll review them sometime in the next few weeks.  I know some of you said you weren't interested/had other options in mind, if so, keep me posted.  This offer won't expire, so if you have no games published now but do publish/write one in the future, you can hold onto this offer and ask me to review/beta read it then.

I'll save mine. I think the game needs a few more days to root out and squish more bugs. maybe 2 or 3. I definitely think it's closer to ready than a week.

Thank you so much for doing that Gryphon!!! Yippeee!! You can just post it in the parlor room so that everyone else can see it too!

Hmm.. seeing that people found a sizeable amount of bugs, I would say to have people play through it at least one more time. Perhaps you yourself can test one more time whether endings 8 and 11 can be achieved or wait for others to find it themselves.

 

 

Honestly, I really did beat on it pretty hard this last time. Granted, I clearly have not found everything and everywhere (I know there's something past those bars), so I haven't tested everything. But for everywhere I did go, I clicked all kinds of links and tried things that no one should do to try and break it. It's certainly getting pretty darn solid.

Unfortunately, the next few days I'm not likely to have a lot of time to keep slamming it. If you want me to beat on secret areas right now, you're going to have to tell me how to find them. I'm not asking, really, I'm okay with finding things eventually on my own -- but if you want me to really test them hard, I'm just not going to be able to do that in the next few days without some serious clues.

Overall, still, loads of fun if you ask me. I feel like everything is pretty balanced and the gameplay part is certainly ready for publication. I imagine no matter what you do, there will be some obscure bugs in there, but I think you've done what you can to really minimize them. Good luck with locating the last remaining ones in the next few days!

Yeah, your testing was really thorough, thanks again!

There's actually nothing past the bars in the hall, they just block the hallway in a fancy way instead of having a wall.  I believe you've found most if not all of the secret areas.  The only one I'm not certain if anybody's found is the secret room you can access from the fountain cave, but other than that, I think you guys have explored the dungeon pretty thoroughly.  (If you haven't found the secret room connected to the fountain cave, one way to find it is to keep using "investigate" in that room until you get a high enough roll.)

Good to hear about the game balance.  I figure I'll test/let other people test over the course of the next day or so, then publish.  No pressure if you've got a busy few days, you've been incredibly helpful!

I agree that it is mostly ready and I've been working it a bit the last few days too.  It's been incredibly fun and I just need 2 endings to make a full set.  Additionally, I can honestly say that it holds up really well on replay, and it is fun trying to accomplish objectives in different ways.
 

I haven't found that secret room yet but I'm going to have to go try now.

I'd have to agree with what everyone else has said. Maybe a couple more days of testing and I reckon you'll be good to go. Like Ogre said, we've been purposefully looking for bugs, and I've played this slightly differently than I normally would do to, clicking on links in weird orders etc. If there's any bugs left that we haven't found then its unlikely for the average player to find them in a normal read. I'm a bit busy, but I'll try and get at least one other play through in over the weekend. 

In terms of 'payment', I'd love a new review on Arthur Quillwyrm when I eventually republish it. Not sure when that's likely to be, so for now I'll just accept playing this game as reward on its own ;)

Finally, Dark Disciple complete. So have now tested all endings.

Alright guys!  Based on the amount of testing that's probably left to be done, I'm going to be aiming to publish this on Saturday afternoon.  I'll be doing a number of test runs myself, and anyone else who wants to, please let me know if you guys run into any more bugs.  You've all been incredibly helpful and sunk a ton of time into tightening up this game, and I really appreciate everything you've done.

I was collecting honey in the bear room and tried using two vials in a row. A message popped up saying the vial could not be used. It then disappeared from my inventory.

Should be fixed now, though that was purely visual bug in the first place, the honey would still have gone to your inventory.

I used the undo curse spell on the heavy boots but they are still stuck to my feet.

nevermind it just updated

Idk if this is a bug or not. I am unable to inspect the tomb after I kill the ghoul in the crypt.

If you've already inspected the tomb, you won't be able to do it again.  If you haven't yet inspected the tomb, then yes, that's a bug.

I had to open it to get the ghoul out but otherwise I haven't. I know I've opened it before in another run, but not this one.

Should be fixed on your next playthrough, it was another single-click link bug.  Thanks for catching that!

Oh, and could you keep an eye on your agility score for me?  There's another agility bug

Yeah. It was fixed when I came back after walking around a bit more. Thanks.

I'm not sure if this is intentional or a bug. When I attack the orcs in the alter room after the original service is over, the orc's health jumps to 97.

not a big deal but shining sword is spelled shinning sword

The 97 bit is intentional, after each combat sequence the defeated monster's life is set to 100 to help me keep track of things.  The fact that you were able to reenter the combat sequence at all was a bug, however, one I'd been looking for an unable to find, so thanks for catching that!  It should be fixed now.

General an unrelated question for everyone:  Thoughts on the title "Legends of the Craig"?  I'm also considering "Secrets of the Craig" and "Kicking Down the Door".

I like secrets of the craig. I also might have found another bug. When I leave offerings, the amount of coppers at the shrine doesn't change. 

Ok so I figured out step 1 for dark deciple but otherwise I'm stumped. 

I'll probably leave that as it is, since it's a minor textual detail that would be a big pain to change, and it's only really relevant if the player decides to steal money from the shrine, which I doubt they'd do immediately after donating.  People can just assume that it's refering to the original amount of money.

Step 1 is the hard part, once you've got the item from the shrine it shouldn't be too hard to complete step 2.

Yeah, probably won't do "Kicking Down the Door", it's my least prefered of the three.

Out of those choices, I like "Secrets of the Craig".

Unlocked Epilogue 8 just a little while ago, but Im clearing through the dungeon before I exit.  Also believe I figured out Epilogue 11, so then will have found them all!

I thought the river sequence branch from the fountain room was fun, I enjoyed it.

Found a small bug up in the crypt this time through and havent had this happen before.  I went into the vampire room first before inspecting the tomb.  When I cam out and inspected the tomb. I automatically receive the Great Axe and the Ghoul is dead without any battle.  and I can repetitively inspect the tomb.

If I then leave the room, and come back, the Ghoul battle proceeds normally. but I can keep inspecting the tomb infinitely

Ah yeah, crypt bug should be fixed now.  There was some coding to route you back to before the battle if the ghoul's health was still at max, but when I changed the ghoul's health I forgot to adjust the code there.  It should be fixed now!

Epilogue 8 - Student of Magic!

Playtest Scores:

Score(8431)

Strength(-1), Constitution(1), Precision(-1), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(1), Intellect(3), Perception(3), Health(32 / 32), Mana(7 / 31)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(71 / 145), Mage(132 / 140), Ranger(43 / 45), Bard(20 / 160), Necromancer(11 / 10)

Arrak(0), Thoed(2), Daiel(1), Qin(0), Morrivik(1)

Fireball(0), Phasing(3), Stone to Flesh(3), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(0), Unlock(1), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(1), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(0), Psychic Attack(1)

Bones(6), Crystal(0), Fan(1), Fish scales(3), Fire beetle glands(3), Glass(1), Keys(1), Moss(5), Moth(2), Shadow scale(0), Ash(7), Webs(5), Coffee(3), Gem dust(0), Honey(3), Ooze(4), Scorpion poison(0)

Investigate(31), Dagger(11)

Orcish(6), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(42 / 52)

I tried to put poison on a fish just to see what happens. Nothing did but it did make an infinite fish scale loop.

Playtest Scores:

 

Score(6303)

 

Strength(3), Constitution(1), Precision(-1), Agility(1), Charisma(-1), Will(-1), Intellect(-1), Perception(3), Health(31 / 32), Mana(8 / 14)

 

Adventurer(1), Rogue(151 / 145), Mage(146 / 140), Ranger(65 / 45), Bard(515 / 160), Necromancer(17 / 10)

 

Arrak(1), Thoed(0), Daiel(0), Qin(0), Morrivik(1)

 

Fireball(0), Phasing(1), Stone to Flesh(3), Blink(0), Speed(0), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(0), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(2), Unlock(2), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(1), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(2), Psychic Attack(0)

 

Bones(4), Crystal(2), Fan(2), Fish scales(1), Fire beetle glands(4), Glass(2), Keys(0), Moss(5), Moth(1), Shadow scale(3), Ash(7), Webs(2), Coffee(3), Gem dust(0), Honey(2), Ooze(2), Scorpion poison(1)

 

Investigate(71), Dagger(18)

 

Orcish(8), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

 

Completion(45 / 52)

Having some issues skinning fish this playthrough.  It says I am getting the scales, but it does not add to my components and I still have same number of fish.  This problem is intermittent, I have been able to scale 2 of my 6 fish.  But it takes a lot of redos.

I probably caused that when I tried to solve the infinite fish scales glitch.  I deleted what I did, and it should be back to normal now.  I'll probably just leave the infinite fish glitch as it is, since I doubt too many people will try to poison the fish, and even with the glitch it's still subtracting from your total amount of fish.

Well, during playtesting over the past couple days I have tried poisoning lots of things, but not the fish. 

It is a bit Ironic that "Yummyfood" tried to poison fish though.

I have unlocked Epilogue 11 - but I will finish the dungeon before submitting scores on this last one.  

please...tell me how you did it

You've completed step one already, so once you have the item that gives you just need to use it a few times.

..................oh

 

Playtest Scores:

Score(11470)

Strength(-1), Constitution(3), Precision(-1), Agility(-1), Charisma(-1), Will(1), Intellect(3), Perception(1), Health(35 / 36), Mana(9 / 20)

Adventurer(1), Rogue(104 / 145), Mage(144 / 140), Ranger(47 / 45), Bard(65 / 160), Necromancer(16 / 10)

Arrak(0), Thoed(0), Daiel(0), Qin(0), Morrivik(2)

Fireball(0), Phasing(5), Stone to Flesh(4), Blink(0), Speed(1), Ghostly Energy(0), Healing(0), Fortitude(1), Arcane Ward(0), Spider Climb(1), Unlock(1), Gust of wind(0), Keen Eyesight(0), Detect Magic(1), Invisibility(0), Speak Language(1), Psychic Attack(1)

Bones(4), Crystal(0), Fan(1), Fish scales(3), Fire beetle glands(3), Glass(2), Keys(1), Moss(5), Moth(0), Shadow scale(0), Ash(8), Webs(5), Coffee(2), Gem dust(0), Honey(4), Ooze(1), Scorpion poison(2)

Investigate(24), Dagger(26)

Orcish(6), Healing(0), Sparkling(0)

Completion(43 / 52)

HEALTH is 35.

On this last playthrough, In the sanctum, the cabinet option is dimmed out.  It still opens after using the detect magic spell, but is dimmed initially upon entry.

Not sure what the problem was, but hopefully what I did fixed it.

@Darius_Conwright @Ogre11 @DBNB @BenCrucifix @Yummyfood

Secrets of the Crag is now published!  

Any chance you could quickly drop a rating on the game to hopefully get it up to 10 ratings more quickly?

Massive thanks again to you all for all the help with playtesting and bug hunting, couldn't have done it without you guys!

Will do! Also, when I have time over the next few days I will leave a review also.

Woo-hoo, congrats!

Gotta do that now haha!!!