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Haha, JJJ, you funny bitch. :p

I agree with you, dude.  There is absolutely no reason for you to sit through something you're not going to get anything out of.  It would be hypocritical for you to do so, if you ask me.  This is coming from someone who does "believe," as you say.  I've never been fond of ass.. people who force, or rather, impose their beliefs on others, nor for that matter those who, as you say, accuse you of being in denial about your closet whatever-it-may-be (..... Anubis <.<).  It shows real intolerance and borderline ignorance, as I see it.

They don't know if they're right, and to dismiss your "beliefs," or lack thereof, because they're different is some shitty business.  But anyways, that's just what I see out of all this.

My only question is:  Why is this you verses your parents?  Unless there's something I missed, there's no reason for there to be a division amongst you.

It just makes things tense when we talk about it, and sometimes it flares up into a flame war... in real life. Without the leet speak. I made the thread after one such encounter.

at first I had my doubts.....but i'm defintely sure....there's powerful guy up there...but I do understand why ppl don't belive

Even when there's that feeling of intensity, which there will be when talking about this stuff, you can still be candid and respectful about the views.  When one loses their cool is when you know who can reinforce their argument and who can't.

Hahah, wow!  I didn't expect that interpretation!

What I was going to write was "assholes," but instead I stuck with "people."  I didn't want to get rid of "ass" though, because I thought it seemed kinda funny: "I've never been fond of ass-people who...." :p

But yes, I know what we're talking about here. haha

You're right dude, what's wrong with me?  Haha, I guess I've beeb trippin' balls lately... I mean vaginas!  Vaginas and asses!

Haha

Been tripping, that is. haha

Wait, I saw lesbians. What about lesbians!?

Anyway, I agree with you, Rommy, and you too Zero. First of all, I believe in God, but I don't think that one should impose one's belief on others. What good will that do? That just causes more hate and that's something that we don't need. Accept the person's beliefs, have an interesting debate, but still be friends or at very least respect one-another. The fact that your parents call this phase arrogance is arrogant in of itself. That's assuming they're 100% correct and you're just a juvenile ass (a nice ass, mind you) that doesn't know what he's talking about, but that's bullshit, and we know it. GODDAMN THIS IS PISSIN' ME OFF!

But I have to say, atheists are also at fault here. Sometimes they get arrogant and disregard religion as one big fairytale (JJJ >8O). The thing is atheists believe that the faithful have no proof, and yet those who worship science believe that atoms exist and gravity is actually there. Well, it's not the same, right? Not really. You believe it's there, you have proof, but you can't see it. You can't see God, but there is proof that he exists. So it's equal in that respect. Now, in conclusion, I'll say that I focus more on the philosophy and the way of life that religion teaches people, and that it can have a positive effect on a culture, but I'm actually for religion NOT having governmental power or it becomes corrupt, and I'll be the first one to cite the Medieval Era and the Crusades as the negative effects of religion. Still, religion's not all bad, science is not all bad, but intolerance is fucking gay. (You like my political correctness there?)

So anyway, Rommy, you have to sit down with your parents and debate. It'd piss me off and I'd never forgive you if let your parents steamroll over you about this. If you don't believe in God, your parents can't pound it into your head. Just remember! Show them respect! GOT THAT!? Good. This is a major issue, mah boi, so present it professionally and take time to hear what your parents say. Give them an opportunity to convert you back, and then try to convert them back. So GOOD LUCK MAH BOI!

But you still see my point that even those who believe in science have faith in their theory.

Haha, I annoyed my chem teacher last year by bringing up a similar point (or at least you reminded me of what happened).

Throughout the year, my friend and I would always ask obscure questions, most of which were made admittedly just to piss him off.  :p  He one days said that it was all technecally "theory," but it was all tested thoroughly and repeatedly, so that it was often regarded as "fact" in the scientific community.  So I asked him, "Then... it's all just theory?"

"They're not just theories...  But essentially, yes.  We can't actually see and count every little atom, but we know it's there because of . . ."

"So... it's a theory.  Am I correct here?"

"Yes.  It's a 'theory'"

"Ok, then given your teaching it and our studying it, it's theology!  Great, you've proven it!  Religion and Science are one in the same!"

I was just being an ass, but was fun. :p

He never told you the difference between a theory and a hypothesis? Then he deserved it.

Rofl, I love pissing off teachers, Zero mah boi. I practically ran my Global History teacher this year. Literally, my classmates would ask me "Is that true?" whenever my teacher taught something by the end of the year.

Anyway, Rommy, I'm basically saying that science and religion both have their pros and cons and truths and falicies.

Not everyone abides to filial piety, and when a parent becomes too controllative, that's bad parenting. A parent should teach their child how to be an adult from day one, and eventually the parent respects the child and the child in turn respects the parent. Filial piety is not fealty, it's mutual respect.

Anyway, I totally agree that forcing religion on people is incorrect. I'm pretty sure it's hypocritical.

Well I'm saying that that's what GOOD parenting is.

Nah, dude, I know the difference between a theory and a hypothesis.  A hypothesis is what's untested, and a theory is what has been tested and replicated or dubbed to be highly likely (which is kinda funny to me), and that's what he was getting at.  These haven't all been definitively proven, but scientists are damn sure it's so.

Anubis: Nice use of "controllative" there. haha

There is a limit, as I see it.  If your parents tell you to do something, you shouldn't feel normally forced, you should do it out of respect for them.  If you do feel forced, then you do it illmannered and it's often done shittily.  In this case, you feel forced and your parents should know that you're getting less out of it, as you may feel like a hypocrite sitting there with a fake face.  And as Anubis mentioned, I would agree that a Christian person trying to force their beliefs on to others is hypocritical... It really isn't the way to do it, and IF God exists, then I'm sure he's not too happy about their oppressive dickishness, driving people away.

Even still:  Do what you feel is right, dude.  If you're having to spend half your day on something you don't believe, then all the advice I can give you is not to dwell on it.  Just go, be pissed for a few hours if that helps pass the time haha, and the forget about it for 6 days (or however often your family goes).  It's better than being pissed all the time (unless you like like that shit for some reason, in which case piss away).

Ya zero, thats what ive been doing for years now. And im sick of sitting there when I could be blasting zombies. Or watching Nadesico. Or finishing Terra Proxima 2. Or working out which homework i was supposed to do in the holidays.

Even though I am a Christian, I think your parents should respect you not being one.  If you don't believe, they should accept that and love you anyway.

Don't want to diminish the back and forth arguments, but I can tell you right now there's no point in "debating" religion. Religious-minded people will never, ever agree with you, even if their arguments collapse under the weight of keen logic. Almost always, they will throw the word "faith" around once this happens, so it will be easy to spot. Atheists will begin calmly, eventually ending with an attack on religion rather than laying out their points.

Both sides may concede that there is a stalemate because, to paraphrase, "You can't prove or disprove his existence." That seems logical until one realizes that all such logic is based on an absolute model of the Universe, rather than a probability model, which makes a lot more sense, spiritually or logically.

In the end, whatever makes you happier, stick with that.

P.S. Arguing politics can cause even worse eruptions.

Especially when nukes are involved.

And thanks for the stereotypes, madglee.

No problem Anubis. Just trying to help you see things clearly.

Hahaha just about sums up Fox News.

Haha, wow... Anubis said what I thought.  Twice.

What'd Anubis say twice? I must have missed it.

Epic fail on Westboro's part. I think it's those people who are the guys going to hell. They spread lies and hatred all in the name of God!? That's blasphemy!

Hehe. Baptists. No wonder the american South has it's current reputation.

Yup, they're very closely entwined... Still, there are those from both parties that aren't so intolerant.  I hate those people too, and as Anubis said, it's blasphemous as well. 

These are exactly the kind of guys I started arguing with a couple years ago (close to the time I joined CYS) on youtube.  A bunch of assholes calling my religion lies and satanist and what have you, one of which was an actual fukin' pastor.  His excuse was that he "preached Hell's fire."  That was his username, I think; you can probably find him there, still bashing and hate mongering.  PreachHellsFire, I think it was.

Anyways... Fuck those guys, haha.

Yup, that's him.  Take a look one of his websites: www.jesusdisciple.net

I think it's over now. They respect my decision, but they still think I'll "come back when I know I don't have all the answers" and when my "intellect stops blocking the Truth".

They seem to be calm, so I'm not going to go to argue with them. It'll just cause grief.

I highly doubt I'll find a reason to go back, though. Let them think that if they want.

Well, if you go back, we do have cookies.

hisss