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Question. As I understand it, I need to get a certain number of points before I get a trophy of my own to give other members. I'm really looking forward to being able to do that, but I'm wondering, how many points I need before I reach it?

I already know it's well over my mark (I'm at 400-something...) but based on what I've seen... 1,000? I'm just wondering how much hard work I have left to go. >_> I'm not a fantastic duelist and I don't always have a ton of time to read through stories long enough to give them a rating, but I do want to get there, I'd just like some idea of my progress.

I believe it is around 1,200 points. But you also need 3 (?) featured games, and 4 trophies of other trophy holders.

Oh.

Well... that... does tell me where I'm at with that one.

Yeah, it's remarkably hard to get a trophy. (or downright impossible, as BZ said). I think that once the site changes to the new format, Alexp will come up with a better system. (hopefully)

The current requirement to get your own trophy almost guarantees that nobody will ever again.

They were fine when the site was young with few members in the pool of competition, but today with the massive number of games already made and the fact that very few Mods get on the site regularly - having your own trophy is a pipe-dream.

The system really needs an overhaul to bring it up to modern times.

Considering there aren't even 4 trophy holders left who stay on this site, I doubt it would be possible without awarding at least one more trophy to an active member (And that's by counting in Alex, who's fairly inactive)

So... ... it's essentially impossible for me right now, then?

Well, f*ck. *sigh* I feel slightly depressed now. And here I was really looking forward to giving out little wolf trophies.

In that case, screw worrying about points, dueling, and rewarding people, I guess. Pity, though, it encouraged me to branch out and view other peoples' stories, which made me want to be able to give out trophies more when I ran into truly talented writers. *scratches head* I'll just get back to chipping away at my writer's block in hopes of making my own kickass game instead.

Completely agree.

What's even worse is it's already been brought up and they're just too stubborn to change the system.

The closest to getting his own trophy next would be Berka.

It would be a penguin I imagine.

Or a hammer. :P

I'd say both.

And yeah, I want a trophy really bad too. Little Pika Lings for the people, YOU GET A TROPHY, AND YOU GET A TROPHY, EVERYONE GETS A TROPHY!! 

I doubt I'm going to get a trophy, and even if I do (one out of a billion chance) it won't be for a loooooooooong time, but mine would be a happy face. ^_^

But if you gave everyone a trophy it would be a worthless freebie and your trophy would never be loved or coveted by anyone.

It would be special to me. I wanna Pika Ling!

rarity, and the anticipation of trophies, is often half the magic. I wanted the hundred point trophy really badly, so I dueled and rated like all fuck until I was finally finished. After I got it, I realized it lost most of its worth to me. My next goal would be the second most easy trophy, the 500 pointer, which, since it is a bigger acheivement, I'd likely cherish more. If Aman and BZ go offline for a million years, then I'd probably be in the running for the lowest of the top posters...

i'm fairly sure that swystkriker is the lowest top poster, so you only have to beat him.

Hmmm, or maybe it's Killa...

I only have 1000-something posts, I'll likely not be in the running for lowst top poster any time soon without some serious bannable spam.

Post Count

You have a bit more than 1000...

I only have 104. XD I'll have to post, post, post since I'm new. :P

Yeah, sure natalo...

Took me a while to figure that one out... Natalo has so many guises that she'd ALMOST make a better assassin than Bria-

*gets stabbed in the back of the neck*

DAMMIT!

Well, made obvious by the fact that the second natalo stopped posting, happy joined the site...

She should post with accounts more consistently, Happy did seem to have a different personality, but then I put two and two together...

Must just be huge coincidence lol. XD

Hrmm... She does seem legit...

Who? P.S. logging off 4 now, it's almost midnight

If you need further proof, Ivan point out that the anime characters both have as their profile pics bear a striking resemblance, an that happy is an exact copy of natalo, except much more reserved, likely because of the crappy reputation as a spammer she was developing. 

Err, the one that Natalie USED to use, before the one she has now.

Haha, was just gonna point that out,

Also, both are 15, and female.

That doesn't mean as much, so is Hugs (I think)

But yeah, some people are just that needy :P

It doesn't mean much by itself, but when all the other coincidences are added up it's enough to make a difference.

Don't see what your saying about the avatar pics, they both are different. nevermind

Though yeah, I agree with you.She joined right after Natalow exiled herself, seemingly. But yeah, it seems we found the new reapers boy XD

I dunno Happy Face still isn't as annoying to me as ReapersBoy.

Plus ReapersBoy was a perv who was into Shotacon.

EDIT: Lol my mistake, he was into Yaoi, not Shota.

So he wasn't into little boys, but he was still more annoying than HappyFace

Well, the original loser is always better than the replacement XD

And what's wrong with being into yaoi? It's no more perverted than being into sex / romance stories about yuri or het. :P

Touche, it's just that it was a detail you (almost) mentioned in the same sentence as a derogatory comment, so... it could imply that, and... xD that'd be extremely hypocritical coming from the writer of "Love Sick"

Hugs is a guy I believe . . .  did I just make an ass of myself, or am I right?

I believe it's like fireslugger and siverflame, the world may never actually know...

Nope, girl (She even stated it in the thread you were posting in, in fact, i'm fairly sure you posted under that very thread)

drakilian knows ALL the girls on the site ;)

*snicker

I don't think I ever saw Hugs as a guy. Silver's a dude (though everyone probably thought otherwise) and I'm a tomboy. (Not a girl, not a dude, not transgender, not neutral, not both.)

Well, this got wildly off-topic...

I'm back. :D

Well, I don't think I visited my own profile since the 1000 mark. My blurb was built to last and If I feel like being vain I can just look at the paper I drew my profile pic on...

Is there anyone who you guys think deserves a trophy right now? I understand that the system isn't perfect but it hasn't failed unless someone who deserves a trophy doesn't have one. I'd say that Berka is the closest. He's got tons of points. That being said, with only one featured game and 2 member trophies, I'm not sure that he's quite there yet. Fuck it, make it three member trophies ;)

Still, I'd like to see at least one more featured game before the conversation starts.

This wasn't started because it was a debate of who deserved a trophy, it was started because I was asking how to get one, and the consensus right now seems to be "You can't. Some of the requirements are currently unattainable." ... If they're right, and it's not currently possible regardless of who is deserving, then yeah, I can see why they're saying the system failed.

(And I'm explaining, not debating, so don't shoot the messenger. I just wanted to know what I needed to do.) 

I replied to the OP, but I was actually responding to BZs post about the system having failed. I did read your post and am aware of how this started, but I believe you got your answer, no?

I don't think that getting your own trophy is unattainable.

The idea is that a lot of trophy bearers only come on 1 a year, sometimes less (I think), so the trophy part is hard.  Plus getting featured is very hard, admittedly rightfully so, but getting 2 features is really hard, especially considering that Berka's Dungeon Stompage isn't even featured.

By having conditions most view as impossible to accomplish, you discourage many people from actually trying. Lower the conditions to more reasonable ones, and more people will try.

I don't actually think they're impossible though. It should be very challenging to get your own trophy. It should take a hell of a long time and considering that, I think things are in the realm of reasonable. What would you change?

Well the three requirements currently are:

1. 1250 points
2. Three featured games (OR) one contest winning game
3. Half of all member trophies

#1 I disagree with because I dislike the way points work, but in all honesty it's fine as a requirement.

#2 needs some reworking since featured games are harder to get now, and story contests don't even exist anymore, but the solution to that could be as simple as making 1 story contest per year.

#3 is where most of the issues come into play, as we have 11 member trophies and only Madglee and Endmaster are "active", while you (JJJ) and Alexp are inactive but still show up. I think Fleshnblood might have showed up once in the past few months as well but still. Realistically speaking we only have 2 people of 11 actually keeping track of the site (and even then, I don't think Endmaster has given a trophy to anyone other than the people who once gave him a trophy).

Not to mention:

A) There's no way of telling what someone wants in exchange for their trophy
B) There's no way of telling if/when certain members will actually show up at the site or leave forever, or if they will notice the thing you did that would have normally earned their trophy

It's just too unrealistic to expect people to get them, and it just turns into them sucking up for trophies rather than becoming an important member of the site, which is the entire point of the trophy if I'm not mistaken.

The easiest way would be the straight up remove the trophy requirement entirely. I can understand the original point of it (to be accepted among those already considered important members), but it's just not relevant anymore.

To be perfectly honest, the whole "It should take a hell of a long time to get a trophy" is incredibly hypocritical of you to say when you obtained yours after just over a year of being a member.

For #2, I think that rather than looking at it in terms of the challenge with respect to the challenge before, it's important to consider things now. Three featured games isn't crazy. TSMPaul, Endmaster, myself, Sethaniel, March and possibly others currently have that number. TSM, Sethaniel and Endmaster all have at least FIVE. If it gets to the point where all of the categories have maximum featured stories, maybe it's time to have this conversation. As it is, I don't think 3 featured games is unreasonable.

For #3, I see what you're getting at! More than half is unreasonable. However, I don't think abolishing this requirement is the right way to go, I think it's important for trophy members to endorse other people becoming trophy members to maintain the integrity of the site. However, I would say that reducing the requirements to 3 or 4 trophies would be acceptable.

As for your last statement, do you think it shouldn't take a hell of a long time to get a trophy?

I'm not sure how I pissed you off here, but please relax. (Assuming the "extremely hypocritical" wording was intentional..)

I'm not upset, just trying to drive home the point that saying you think something should take a long time seems really unfair when you yourself got it in a relatively short period of time.

I don't particularly care how long it takes. What should matter more is the effort put forth by the user, and I don't see personal trophies as a valid way of measuring that. Not when most of those involved are no longer active.

Effort counts, but just because you work hard doesn't make you a good writer, sadly.

Not really the angle I'm going at here lol. If someone is really good, and tries hard, then there shouldn't be an expected amount of time to take to achieve a personal trophy.

I mean JJJ wrote his best story in what, 3 days?

Well, there's always the slight possibility that a great author decides to troll or give put to whoever, and the trophies aren't meant to be given out regularly.  Though it's minor to be honest.

I do understand what you're saying.

Hypothetically, if it had taken me ten years to get my own trophy, would you find my statement more acceptable? Why?

I would have still disagreed but since you were effectively practicing what you preached I wouldn't have called you hypocritical.

Why would you disagree?

Because something taking a long time doesn't make it difficult, and something difficult may not take a long time. With the exclusion of the unwritten requirement that the person be well known/well liked (which the trophies more or less ensure), accomplishing the points and the story requirements can be done in a relatively short period of time with the right amount of effort.

Simply saying "It should take a long time, so it's fine if the people with trophies are inactive" is ignoring the actual issue of people not being able to get the trophies. We can easily change the requirements, which most agree make it so getting your own trophy is currently impossible, and we risk nothing by doing so, so there's really no reason to not make a change.

The important part is that the change is for the better, but we'll never get to that stage of deciding on how to make it better if everyone in charge is going "everything is fine so there's no need to make a change".

"Simply saying "It should take a long time, so it's fine if the people with trophies are inactive" is ignoring the actual issue of people not being able to get the trophies. We can easily change the requirements, which most agree make it so getting your own trophy is currently impossible, and we risk nothing by doing so, so there's really no reason to not make a change.

The important part is that the change is for the better, but we'll never get to that stage of deciding on how to make it better if everyone in charge is going "everything is fine so there's no need to make a change"."

Two things:

1. I already said that I'd be in favor of dropping the trophy requirement to 3 or 4. I think that deals with the inactivity problem. I agree with you there, and I've stated it so I'm not sure why you are feeling like no one thinks a change is necessary. I've never said that it's okay that people are inactive. Not enjoying your tone/style here, I'm trying to be reasonable.

2. I'm not trying to enforce a static requirement that a trophy takes a long time to get. If I wanted that, I'd advocate a minimum time limit. That being said, I do want it to take a long time to get a trophy, in most cases. Someone can put up a front for so long but at some point, it's likely that if they're secretly a horrible user, or someone who is just ripping off other people's work to get featured stories, it's more likely to come out over a longer time. Also, having a trophy means that you represent the site now. You should be an integrated member of the community. Making it take a long time to get a trophy will increases the probability of the member being more integrated into the community.

You're changing it from being half of all trophy holders to basically all active trophy holders then, which doesn't solve anything, since the current trophy holders could for whatever reason leave/go inactive as well. The point here is that it's too unreliable to be expect users to try and get the trophies.

I never said you were trying to enforce a time requirement, nor am I trying to say it shouldn't take a long time, but using that you feel it should take a long time, as an excuse for the sporadic activity of many trophy holders, just doesn't make sense. A user shouldn't have to wait an arbitrary amount of time for the chance at someone's trophy.

If they actually are an integrated member of the site then they should be here. If not then the trophies are merely fond reminders of people who once were important to the site.

"You're changing it from being half of all trophy holders to basically all active trophy holders then, which doesn't solve anything, since the current trophy holders could for whatever reason leave/go inactive as well. The point here is that it's too unreliable to be expect users to try and get the trophies."

I don't think 3 trophies is that insane. Historically, there's always been 3+ trophy users active and I don't see the issue here. That being said, do you have an alternative besides abolishment?

"I never said you were trying to enforce a time requirement, nor am I trying to say it shouldn't take a long time, but using that you feel it should take a long time, as an excuse for the sporadic activity of many trophy holders, just doesn't make sense. A user shouldn't have to wait an arbitrary amount of time for the chance at someone's trophy."

You did say that you didn't think it should take a long time. When I asked if you disagreed with saying that it should take a long time, you said yes. So far, it seems like no user has ever been barred from receiving a trophy due to lack of trophies. There is no ambiguity here.

Guess I'm wording things oddly.

"I don't particularly care how long it takes."

Is my standpoint. I don't think we should expect it to take a long time, but at the same time I don't think we should expect it to happen quickly. Time isn't important, is what I'm trying to say.

A set number of trophies isn't a good idea because people come and go from the site. I gave you my solution, I don't see a way to keep the trophies as part of the requirements, so I'm not going to try and make them work into it somehow.

Pretty sure Endmaster was barred from getting his trophy for a while due to the trophy requirements. You could easily make the case for him earning one all the way back to 2008, when he had 5 featured games (and that's only including the ones currently still featured). Yet he didn't get a trophy of his own until 2012, when Madglee and Alexp gave him their own which gave him the requirements.

Even ignoring that, the current requirements make it so many people don't even bother trying to get the trophies. Within this thread itself Keil came in just curious about it, and quickly was told it's impossible and gave up on it.

Anyway, I'm just repeating myself at this point, so that's about it.

The fact that endmaster had to wait 4 years because he didn't have the trophies required was something I kept on forgetting to say in this thread. The rules themselves say that they are just guidelines. Still, I think there has to be a trophy requirement. 3 seems reasonable.

On Trophies

Endmaster had 4 trophies in 2008. Therefore by changing the trophy restriction to 3, he would have gotten a trophy, providing he had enough points at that point (possible).

On Time

Time is important. As I've said above, the average time required to get the trophy is also the time that the community has to weed out potential assholes or what have you. If it takes awhile to get a trophy, then it makes it more likely that the people who get the trophy will be long-lasting members of the community. Perhaps if it had taken longer for Havacoman, Solostrike and the gang to get trophies, they wouldn't have gotten them and then we wouldn't have inactive trophy users. Who knows? The other thing is that trophies are the highest honor a user can have. They shouldn't be too plentiful. Let users set goals on lower aims first. Start with attempting to get a featured story or integrate yourself with the community. Rate every game on the site, etc, etc.

A trophy is akin to a gold medal. You don't sign up for your first gymnastics class and feel like a gold medal is extremely plausible. You sign up, you aim to compete in your first competition. Then you aim to win a competition. Then you aim to win a bigger competition. Then you aim to qualify for the olympics, etc.

Doesn't Dungeon Stompage count? (Since it's on the front page...)

No, it's in some weird situation where it wasn't seen as better than any of the current fantasy games, so it wasn't featured, but it was unique enough that it was put on the front page.

Honestly the whole feature game requirement itself is a bit outdated, since it's progressively harder to get your story featured as more stories come out. Not to mention some categories are much easier to get featured in.

... Seriously? Being on the front page does not count as featured? xD Wtf? 

Normally being on the front page is a side effect of being featured, but yeah, being on the front page doesn't always mean you are featured (nor does it count as such).

Unsure of why though.

You could be put on the front page for a variety of reasons. One of them is that the storygame is simply amazing, and that's the same reason things get featured. Other times, it's because the game does something that shows off the site's capabilities. Locked Out (The Movie) II will always be on the front page simply because it shows the site in a completely different medium, even if it wasn't the best in its category.

Locked Out Two was featured though.

I understand that. But even if it gets replaced 15 times so it's not even in the top 15 games in the category, it will remain on the front page for the reasons stated above.

Of course.

I'd say the system as failed yet. it is dying though, the current trophy holders are becoming more and more inactive and to be featured is nearly impossible - who the hell is going to top 'Dead Man Walking' or "Ground Zero' or 'Mommy' or 'Eternal' or 'Order of the Midnight Sun' exactly? So someone has really got to start thinking about the system to try and improve it.

Going to BZ, 'Dungeon Stompage!' could easily stand as a featured game if it wasn't thrown into the most competitive category there is. So in my opinion (which really doesn't mean much =P) this 'BZ Trophy' conversation should start soon. (Also BZ is a coding master and a nice person)  

I disagree, to an extent.  The point of featured is that they are the best, so to be featured you NEED to be the best. To get a trophy, I think it makes sense to at least top one, or at least get a 8/8-7/8 game to somewhat count.

But yeah, I think that BZ should be an admin XD Good games, big part of the community etc. Good sense, and active too.

I'm just saying that there are some tittles that are still 'trophy level' (Dungeon Stompage for example) but aren't able to outshine a epic like Eternal or OMS. (In which case I suggest having people vote/discuss whether a tittle is deserving of 'trophy level')   

'Tittle'? 

Oh, yeah. I agree then. Of course, a game has to be decidedly really really good, have the general forum members agree, and the admins to approve.

You know what? I remember back in 06 or whenever it was, people were saying the same things about games like Cryptode and Mattias the One Knight. The thing is, until someone publishes the equivalent of Game of Thrones (in terms of quality), we're not at a stage where the games are "too good to be better than".

Furthermore, if you actually can't write at a comparable level to at least OMS, you probably shouldn't have a trophy. It's not an extremely high standard. That storygame was written in 3 days.

Point JJJ

I'm not actually trying to win a debate here, haha. The way I learn is to argue, if you can point out a flaw in my thinking then I'll try and find a flaw in your logic and if I can't, then there must be a flaw in my thinking and then I can make a change.

Anyways, glad to see you're still around 3J. ^_^

I could never leave you, Aman.

-insert mustache comment here-

3J, are you planning on making any more games?

Yes. At some point.

How's the work in med school? I hope it's gotten somewhat easier. 

I'm not in med school! I hope to get in, though.

Oh, thought you were already in med. ^_^

Hope everything is going well in Pre-Med (hopefully I'm right on this assumption. ;P)

Isn't pre-med college?

Maybe?XD 

Yep. Pre-med is basically a bachelor of science where you take the required pre-med courses such as biochemistry. I'm doing just that. (We call it University up here in Canada, I know the terms are interchangable down south but college refers to less accredited institutions up here)

College - 2 year diploma

University - 4 year degree

Basically sums it up so the non-Canadians understand.

Oh, so it's like community colleges in the Us? (which are 2 years, I believe)

Community college is free though isn't it?

We have community colleges here as well.

Yeah. 

So would it be more like a vocational school? 

Our community college and colleges act the same I think, just with community ones being free.

You're hoping to get into med school, JJJ? I remember those days...

What are you hoping to become by the end of your studies?

Probably a pilot.

:P Smart-ass. "Medical school" does not explain what, exactly, someone will be. Do you have any idea how many different kinds of doctors there are out there?

General Physician, Internist, ER doc, Hospitalist, Palliative Care, Pediatrician, Critical care specialist, Geriatrician, Anesthesiologist, Surgeon, Cardiologist, Endocrinologist, Urologist, Gastrologist, Hepatologist, Gynecologidt, Obstetrician... just to name a few. (And I really do mean a -few-. That's the nice thing about this field, you've got pleeeenty of options.) There are also people who get their PhD in nursing, meaning it's possible to be both a doctor and a nurse.

Hahaha Killa.

I'd like to be a surgeon. Beyond that, I'll see when I get there haha.

Nice. I loved being in the OR, myself. I hope you have a strong stomach, though. The sights didn't bother me, personally. (A classmate of mine passed out, though, which I found hilarious.)

I mean, it gets pretty brutal depending on the procedure, but I still thought it was very cool. The smells in there, on the other hand, are something else. Cauterization... drilling into rotten bone... it fills the whole room. However, I'm sure that if it's something you really want to do, you'll get use to it quickly.

I'm aware, haha. That sort of thing doesn't bother me.

sounds like a job for Endmaster, dear god could you imagine the horror!

Haha, literal boners.

:)

The sight of such stuff usually isn't what does most people in, it's typically the smell. When stuff is rotting or filled with shit, even if you've got a strong stomach it's still pretty unpleasant to be breathing in.

When I was briefly majored in mortuary science the bodies were preserved so it pretty much only smelled like formaldehyde and other similar chemicals.

Still dunno how anyone can work in sewerage treatment plant though. Had to go to one of those for an earth science class. That had to be the worst.

How many different science classes did you go to!?

=P Yeah, that's what I said.

Well that explains a lot . . . by god you are one highly educated individual!

*stares at his own game which he hopes to complete in 3 months*

*stares at galobtter's poor sad post, sitting all alone in this shadowy dark corner - completely ignored and covered in spiderwebs...

*Gets out featherduster*

*Which gets eaten by a mustache*

*Which gets scolded by an otter*