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Well, I watched 13 Reasons Why recently over the past few days, and I decided to make a thread solely for the purpose of bitching about it. As I've spent thirteen hours on this I have a lot to say, and while I doubt anyone will read all this shit, fuck it, I'm going to bitch like a motherfucker anyway. In the show's defense, the filiming and camera work is really good. That is all. 

The premise is simple: a girl, Hannah, who killed herself posthumously bitching about her death through tapes. 

The people she blames are either didn't do much bad or so over the top in their dickishness its ridiculous. The first one is some douche who after making out with her once spread rumors about her being a whore for no reason whatsoever, burning the entire relationship down because "That's what jocks do!", rather than, I don't know, actually try fuck her at a later stage. The second is a good friend of hers who overreacts at one point and hits her, but fuck it, she got angry, big whoop.

The word example by far is Alex. All the dude does is write that Suicide Girl has the best ass in the school. That's all he does, and Suicide Girl dedicates a massive portion of her suicide tapes to blaming him. She bitches about "Gender objectification" and how "It's not a compliment" like its some big whoop. He's so guilty from her accusations he does two fairly suicidal things, despite having done nothing wrong.

Then there's the weird, stalking autistic kid, who was more deserving of pity than anything else. Like the Stranger Things Guy. He his window repeatedly stoned and a naked picture sent around, while Hannah laughs off his attempt to ask her out, despite him being an awkward fuck. Asian Lesbian girl is super-ashamed of being lesbian, despite the fact she has two dads and no one seems to give a shit, and there's an openly lesbian girl in the class. It's 2017, this character is fucking ridiculous. Then we have sexy Valentines Day Guy, who shows up an hour late to the date with Hannah and tries to finger her, but he's such a fucking exaggeration of a dickhead I wonder why the fuck she agreed to the date. She knew he was among the group that started the slut and lesbian rumors around her. It should've been obvious he was to be avoided.

Sexy Asian boy was next. Same issue of him being with the dickheads, even showing up to watch her get fingered by Valentines Day Guy, who she yells at loudly when he says he likes her for her, not her "great ass" in reference to Alex and then says "He should've got over it" unironically, as if forgetting she said this in her suicide note. In class they all have "Compliment bags" for people to write written compliments to each other. Despite how much of a little bitch you'd have to be to do that, all Alex does is get rid of hers. Big fucking whoop, next guy. Here's Poetry Dude, who likes poetry. Hannah opens the conversation by bitching about him making the list that Alex said she had a nice ass on. Big whoop, no one cares, he's not even straight. Plus, he was the best character by far, because he was saying what I was thinking. She bitches about it twice. Then later he publishes her poetry in the school paper. In his defense it was bad poetry. He doesn't claim its his, leaves it anonymous and only does so after asking her to do so and saying its going to really help someone deal with their struggle, and after she had read it out publicly. Hey, next is number one, Rumor Douche! He gets two! His girlfriend passes out, and she doesn't stop Rapey McGee from raping her. However, luckily Hannah is in the room, in the closet to stop him! For some reason, she doesn't, she just lets it happen. Alright, what a bitch. Not only that, she doesn't tell Jessica what happened. Or anyone. Why is this he girl we're supposed to sympathize with?

Then we had Sherri, who knocked over a stop sign, which for some bizarre reason Hannah keeping bitching about them needing to call someone to repair it. They don't try to prop it up or anything. Then, there's a car crash and friendly Jerry dies. It would've taken hours, if not days for it to be repaired, and a stop sign wouldn't have done shit, but for some reason Hannah feels it's OK to blame the death on Sherri. She also just takes a dude's phone after yelling at him, tells him to shut up when he asks how long it'll take and then when he asks if she wants a charger just walks away. The Protagonist is next. It turns out he's been raping her younger sister, and was only using their fri... no, it turns out he did nothing. Nothing at all. So dragging him through all this shit was nonsense, he shouldn't have got a tape, and there's not even thirteen reasons. Fuck that, my plot twist was better. It turns out she was just a psycho who was a massive bitch to this nice dude and yelled at him because other, unrelated people were mean to her. So hang on, if Justin did nothing, why the fuck does everyone keep telling him "We all killed Hannah", including his friend Troy, and why when he asked Troy right beforehand "Did I kill Hannah?" he said "Yes." On the bright side, the girl just revealed to be cutting herself says "Suicide is for the weak." Irony.

OK, two more. Despite my hatred for the show, it's been really fun to watch, if not for the reasons the creators wanted. Next was Bryce, who seemed like the nicest of the douches, except for the horrible raping. Yeah, this guy was a dick. To be fair, and I know this is blaming the victim, don't go into the hot tub of a guy you've witnessed raping your friend should be obvious. Funnily enough, she was only there because directly after complaining about the massive financial burden they were under, lost a big bag of money meant for the bank. Fucking hilarious. Anyhow, this was probably the shittest thing to happen to her, but eh, happens to a shit ton of people and they don't find the need to kill themself. Awful thing, not an excuse. Still, Bryce was pretty much the only evil one of the people Hannah blamed. Last was the Guidance Councilor, where it's brought up that Hannah never said no, for some reason, during the awful raping. Whatever. The Guidance Councilor tries to help, but honestly while he does a shit job, but he was at least pragmatic about it, saying if she won't press charges with no gurantee of success she has to move on. Hannah lastly says "None of you cared enough", to which she can go fuck herself, its no one else's responsibility, and many of them did care a shit ton.

There's also the various parents, the worst of all was by far Hannah's mother. It took until episode six for the mother to wonder if she had done anything wrong, and even then, it was only to say "We shouldn't have moved" rather than, "Oh, maybe we should've done more as parents so our kid didn't want to die." She sees the classic graffiti on the bathroom stores calling various people sluts or whores and makes a huge deal about it, giving out and bitching about how this causes suicide. These are the parents who are suing the school for failing to prevent it rather than taking blame, taking money from the public school system. She has a line where she asks the lawyer what her son's life is worth. Like, obviously no amount of money would remedy it, but you're still demanding more and more money, you greedy bitch.

The last character worth noting is Tony, who is the only guy not "mean" to Hannah. Why is he different? Because, and they specify this is why, he's gay, and hence hasn't oogled or groped Hannah. Yeah, fuck straight people, good point, show. Fuck it, that reminds me, there's no consistency. Hannah's parents can't afford to have alarms for their house to make ends meet, but sometimes they have enough to buy Hannah a brand new car for the dance.

Thinking about it, Hannah constantly flirted with the "Exaggerated Asshole" group for some reason, and yet acted surprise when they acted like exaggerated assholes. Look, the girl knows like seven guys. One is a stalker who takes pictures, but he's at worst the third best choice. Then there's the guy he liked who is also her friend, but he doesn't go for him. Then there's the guy she gets along with, who's nice and kind and does nothing wrong. She goes for none of these three. Instead, she goes on a date with two of them and constantly hangs out and goes to parties with them. With the douche jocks who sent pictures around and started the rumors of her being a slag, spread the lesbian ones and came to watch her get fingered in a diner. At that point, fuck it, it's your fault shitty things are happening.

The Protagonist was also constantly hallucinating and fucking bonkers, so that was weird. 

All in all, this is the story of how a pretty, non-fat girl with two loving, non-divorced parents has such a bad life.  She's a vindictive bitch of a person who uses suicide not as an escape for as a weapon to hurt those who wronged her badly and those who did relatively little wrong alike. She acts like a massive bitch at multiple times to multiple people, but when she does it its seen as fine, but when others do it, its enough for her to, at least partially, blame them for her suicide. When one character points out how she brings it on herself, she insults him. 

On top of this, the slow is really slow-paced, and doesn't have anything like humor or bright spots, just a constant depression. It's so slow paced that characters note the main dude is taking far longer than everyone else to listen to all the tapes, despite it being made several times he's desperate to hear his own tape.

The show is one big jerk off, a weird fantasy for the suicidal teen about how missed they'll be and how they could get revenge. Hannah was one of the most unlikeable characters I've seen on TV without trying. I honestly think the only reason anyone gives a shit about this show is because they're either shitty teens who feel "empowered" that their emotional whining is being glorified, bitching about shit like sexual objectification and how much you give a shit about your feelings as you look desperately for attention, or some asshole who thinks talking about suicide makes something deep. 

There was even three seperate goddamn trigger warnings, which spoiled three episodes by telling me there was going to be a rape or suicide. The show was so "emotional" that they had therapy dogs on set, for fuck's sake. It didn't even have a message that would actually help the suicidal, like "Tell your parents or a teacher". Instead, thanks to suicide Hannah managed to expose those who wronged her and make them pay. Honestly at the end of the day, she took the coward's way out when faced with problems that weren't that big, and that was rewarded by the show. At the very least she had loving parents, Troy and Clay who were good friends, and the poetry group.

Whoa, that was long. Cool. Anyhow, a lot of this hate was amplified by the summary that helped me know what was going on, as I was doing other shit as I watched, which kept adding notes of appreciation for the main character and basically disagreeing with everything I though. Anyhow, fuck the show, it was immoral trash, if you liked it you're a little bitch. Good fun to watch and hate, though. It was super fun to experience, if not for the intended reasons.

"There was even three seperate goddamn trigger warnings, which spoiled three episodes by telling me there was going to be a rape or suicide."

Yeah, you usually want to be pleasantly surprised by such things.

Well this was a nice glittering gem of hatred.

Still think this comment left on Youtube about her suicide was hilarious:

"Watching this scene, I cringed when she slit her wrists and my cat approached me because she sensed that I was stressed"

Even though I'll probably never watch this on my own accord, it's good to see you had fun.

Long-winded, abysmal teen angst that panders endlessly to the lowest common denominator and abuses and defeats the purpose of the medium that it's inflicted upon?

Sounds like they finally made Life is Cutscenes into a show.

/r/lifeisstrange right now

Brad, please! Brad, you're scaring me! Please put that back where you found it, Brad! Please take back all the information you just gave me and erase the connection I just made. It's too horrible to be true! I can't accept the fact that this actually has a target audience! I'm not equipped to deal with that notion!

Feel free to buy it for me.

I think it's about lesbians.

(The boring kind, not the objectified kind)

Are there boring ones?

Single ones.

Do you think all the lesbians in your search history are in loving relationships?

I wouldn't know, I don't have any lesbians in my search history anyways.

Sure, whatver you say, kid.

Even if they were my favorite kind of lesbian, they're like 17, they say "Hella" in an only semi-ironic sense, surround themselves with pretentious themes, broke-ass time travel, and generally so much bullshit that any amount of boner attributed to them has a difficult time existing at best. And I mean, a Dark-Souls-Difficult time.

17 is not a put off in any way, it seems like a plus.

Ohhh right, you're in Ireland. 

Nah, 17 is still creepily young in most states. 19 is our 17.

I understand that the age of consent varies state by state, but I'm not exactly sure how crossing some imaginary line to do an act makes something creepy.

There's a certain maturity level attributed to different ages in different cultures. You don't expect the same shit from a 4 year old that you would from a 5 year old, and that sort of expectation carries on differently depending on where you grow up and who you grow up with. Obviously, individuals will vary, and the notion doesn't hold up to individual scrutiny, but age of consent in a lot of places does tend to correspond with ideas of emotional and physical maturity, whether present in the individual at that age or not.

In places where consent and drinking age are 16, more adult aspects are associated with 16 year olds. If you asked a person in, say, Mississippi, or wherever they do that, to picture a random 16 year old, they'd probably be more adult, and have features that people in, say, New York, would more closely associate with 18 year olds. If you asked the same New Yorker to picture a 16 year old, they're probably thinking of someone who's not all developed, kiddish, and generally sort of creepy to have sex with.

For that same reason, since the characters in LiS also very much look and act like that visualization I have that's not all developed, kiddish, and generally creepy to have sex with, I don't feel nor understand the attraction, and it makes the fanart creepy. I mean, I get it, they're fictional chicks that can be toyed with on the internet, I'm not surprised or genuinely disturbed, but I associate a general offness about sex and people willing to have sex with them that isn't going away. I can't really justify it from a philosophical standpoint, and I'm not about to, it's just ingrained, so that's how I feel about it.

There's really not a strong enough difference in culture in any way to make the maturity age of a kid different one state over. In fact, I dare say there is none at least in relationship to how "maturity" is seen as.

I'm pretty sure there's big enough of a difference in the perception of these ages, if not the culture surrounding them. But then again, it is really associated with culture. The bible-belty areas in the South, where there was a lot of "Romance" and nepotism being practiced, probably thought a person had their mental and biological shit together when they're 16, since that's when de-facto arranged marriage generally happened and ended up being okay, so they chose 16 when the lines were being drawn. In more urban areas where big families and nepotism aren't as much of a thing, less fucking between people generally considered adults happened until you were 17 or 18. So, they associate that image of maturity with 18 year olds more readily than they would with anyone younger.

That cultural difference alone is enough to make the imaginary line where maturity goes get put in different places that are each years apart. It doesn't have to be a "strong" difference, it just has to be present when the line is officially drawn, and then enforced as a law.

I honestly don't think that's the case. While the line might be drawn their, there would've been plenty of 16 your olds fucking and romancing in urban areas. I doubt the differing communities would've batted an eye at the difference of a year.

Well hang on, the difference has to be enough for it to be creepy in one place and not creepy in the other according to you, which is the only thing I'm really arguing against, not the legality of the thing.

Well, I found this interesting so I did a quick Google and it seems that both characters are apparently older than seventeen anyway. 

Well that just makes me sad. They talk like middle-schoolers, have the faces of student drivers and act like high-school sophomores. All relative, of course.

That's like totally not hella, sir. 

When your time comes, may the loudest kazoos and the sharpest recorders in all the orchestras of Hot Naraka rape your ears to the tune of 'Together Forever' for the pain your utterance has caused me.

Hmm, that sounds a bit interesting. 

I mean, now that you mention it, I might actually wanna hear this song if it were done right, but these are kazoos and recorders from Hell, so naturally they can only be the most annoying version of themselves.

I feel like it's the best way to describe what I hear whenever characters in LiS speak.

It doesn't have to be that big of a difference for it to be creepy in one place and not in another. It just has to be the little difference it takes in order to make it a law, and the awareness we have of shit like child molesters and other creeps will make people after a certain age below the set limit into monsters with creepy desires, and it can be very easy to subconsciously perceive an imaginary line as a definitive line between mature and immature. I can't really share much that isn't anecdotal, but a lot of people here in Wisconsin generally consider 18 year olds to be adults.

Younger adults, yeah, but adults. And there's a line beyond that where sexual conduct is considered creepy as fuck. I can't tell you how many times in casual conversation I've heard blue areas on this map referred to as "weird" and "Backwards" whereas, having actually talked to friends in Michigan and Kentucky about that kind of shit, they don't see the problem with it, but draw a hard line at 16 between right and creepy, and still consider something as "old" as 18 some sort of prudish.

It really does have to be a big difference for something to be accepted in one place and creepy in another. The law has precisely jack shit to do with what we find creepy or not. I doubt most people in Ireland would find a 16yr old dating a 17yr old creepy, but a ninety year old and a 20yr old? Yeah. When the overall culture you exist in is normalizing teen sex and shit like that, it's hardly a creepy thing just because it's illegal where you are.

Yeah, but someone super old dating someone much younger is fairly creepy either way across the board. Obviously below 16 it becomes pretty creepy as theAmerican culture is then saying its weird and wrong, but that's a huge difference between 17 and 18.

Okay, I should have phrased that differently. Yeah, nobody gives a shit about teen sex, but there are perceptions of maturity associated with age of consent, and they are similar despite the age of consent being different things. And the creepiness can be fairly widely perceived even when two places and societies aren't that much different. Generally, though, anyone dating below age of consent that is on or above it is creepy, though that perception changes in places where the Age of Consent is different. In Wisconsin, a 16 year old and an 18 year old dating is decidedly off-kilter and weird. One's legally (and perceived to be) mostly and adult, and the other is legally (and perceived to be) mostly a kid. A guy from Ohio would see things differently, because they're both at or above the age of consent, and therefore are brought back into the realms of two kids fucking, which nobody gives a shit about.

Again, I disagree that there the age of consent has any major bearing on perceptions of maturity. Fuck, I don't even think dating below the age of consent is particularly creepy.

I mean, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. There's a certain tone that's used when the notion of that line and the perceptions before and after are talked about with people I talk with. Maybe it's different in Ireland, where Chris Hansen and Dateline aren't basically spoken-word memes and the media isn't a shock-based industry, but everyone I've heard brush the subject does personally see that line, and expect certain things even if they kinda know deep down that it's silly and harmless. Little things easily get nitpicked into big things overtime like this.

Yeah, I guess we will.