Forums » The Lounge » Read Thread

Undr is doing better than most of them and she's dead!

We suck but without us you other guys wouldn't look as good, remember that.

EDIT: Also I'd have more comms if you weren't doing Dusty Fist and its sequel an injustice by not commending them.

That is so sad.

In an ideal Warden world, they would have had Bucky and Romulus at least carrying a lot of the weight for contributions. Perhaps even Leora and Fic as secondary support contributors. Undr, if she wasn’t dead would probably have at least been still within the top five due to reviews.

As it stands now though, only Chris and Pug are the worthwhile members.

Do we feel another Roll of Honour might be just the thing to inspire the Wardens to greatness? :D Though as I might get commended for it, it probably wouldn't help them very much... tbh I stopped doing that thing weekly because the commendation rankings hardly ever changed, then I did it monthly but again stopped for the same reason. Now I'm considering whether it's worth doing annually or not... maybe it would be good if it was like the Points and people got rewards for reaching certain levels of Commendations ? Like a bonus of 100 Points for reaching 100 Commendations or admin trophies for reaching certain scores or... something like that? :)

This might be relevant: http://chooseyourstory.com/forums/feature-wishing-well/message/25613

Interesting, hadn't realized the Orders themselves were going to be randomized. I think we do have a somewhat more even spread of active members across them now than we did when Sage Superiority first became a thing....Pugpup will continue to be a champion of the Wardens along with Chris, and there are other Wardens around frequently enough who are certainly capable of contributing to the cause.

Still I think a yearly reroll would make things interesting. If this became a thing people really got into the team aspect of (as I assume was the original intent) it would make for a fun bit of chaos with shifting alliances and the like.

IF we didn't just wind up with different but equally unbalanced results next time, which will be a risk every year.

It'd be nice if admins could manually change people's roles, because right now at least there are certain people on the site I'd make an effort to keep spread out on separate teams, and that will always be changing as new people come into the picture and old ones go inactive and then come back again.

I thought about role changing but I’m sort of attached to the idea of it being beyond reproach. I’ll think on that more.

I can see a lot of issues with it. For instance, it's not fun if some order gets nerfed because it's doing too well, or whatnot. It makes it feel like it doesn't really matter how much effort you put in, your order will just bet buffed if you do nothing.

No one cares right now, but I would like to add some flavor to it to encourage people to be commendation hungry. I have a few ideas along this line but I don't want to reveal them publicly yet.

Potentially, it would be sufficient to do better randomization. I can imagine two things:

1. Assigning active users equally to all 4 orders and then assigning inactive users to all 4 orders
2. New users being proportionally more likely to join suffering orders

I basically just don't love the idea of admins being able to "move" commendations from one order to another. It feels cheapening to me.

There is always the "free agency" model:

The orders stay as they are. But after a set period of time, a member can become a "free agent" and potentially "sign" with the order of his/her choosing... but once that decision is made, it's locked in. Of course, this would imply that orders could collectively bargain with individual members, and that there would be something of "value" that could be exchanged between the parties.

Interesting, but then people might just flock to the best order, and then it’d REALLY be stacked.  Perhaps if you had to trade places with someone else in that order, things might stay balanced.  Or if all the commendations you earned stayed with the order you earned them in, even after you switched 

 

 

Golden State Sages

New York Yan...chitects.

I wanted to say Golden State Wardens but they're the opposite of stacked.

So agreed, we would need to impose a luxury tax...

I formally request to remain a Marauder.

beg to the dice gods.

With his luck he'll be a Warden along with all the other useless site members.

You're probably right. I hope I remember to wear a belt that day.

RNG has not been kind to the Wardens.

While Sages contain the elite, most active and helpful members, Architects composed of essentially everyone who's not a sage in the mid-tier, and the Marauders being mostly carried by End like a metaphorical Marauder King we all know he could be if he wanted, Wardens are unfortunately composed of the most lazy, non-creative, or inactive members of the site.

Being that pretty much half of the members on the distinguished members list are either inactive, banned, or some randos who doesn't actually post on the forum, really shows that the Random Number Gods could not have damned us more by not even giving a single token elite member that acts as the Warden figurehead. We don't even have a mod or a personal trophy owner.

In fact, looking at the list, how many members do you see that actually have, or have had, a featured story before the commendation update?

I'll save you the trouble: it's Romulus. Just Romulus.

Sure, we had some known people who commonly got featured comments, and getting like 3 commends per comment, and that's definitely the fastest way to get some commendations, but featured/commended storygames are, by far, the best way to get a whole ton of them at once. And, goddang, we just did not have enough good writers. We had some insightful members who occasionally got a commended forum post (like me, Tim, Hi), but Forum Posts are only worth 1 commend, which makes it by far the worst way to earn them based on my own formula called the "effort : earning" ratio.

(For a quick rundown, it goes like this: Storygames require a large amount of effort, but have a large payoff, to the ratio is pretty much 1:1. Forum posts, while much less writing than a storygame, require an above-average level of effort when compared to normal posts. And you REALLY have to stick out and go above and beyond to be noticed by the mods, who then have to consider if it really is worth being commended and practically sponsored by them, all for a single commendation at the end of the day. The ratio is about 1:0.5. Finally, comments require pretty much the same amount of effort as a forum post, only it's pretty much just a review of a story you read rather than the more random and chaotic thoughts of the forum. So, upon racing to get one of those 3 featured comments spots, the review is written, judged by a mod (probably End, but featuring comments is anonymous, so who knows), and if featured your reward is 3 Commends. As you can probably tell, it's arguably easier to get a featured comment than a commended post, and you ultimately gain more out of it. The ratio is somewhere around 1:2

TL;DR featured comments op plz nerf)

In conclusion, The Wardens were dealt an unlucky hand with so few prominent members. Sure, you could argue that ANYONE can be a great member with enough motivation and hard work and all that other jazz, but I guess you could say the same thing about homeless people turning into middle class. Sure, it could happen, but it sure as hell is going to take a lot of time and effort some people just don't have.

We are starting to get like a "peasant king" thing going on with Chris, though, so we'll see how that turns out.

Anyway, I'm Tim, and this has been a pretty high-effort post that I spent a while thinking about, that will, at max, get a single commendation. Here's hoping.

I'll commend your post if you reply to this post with 250 words about Romulus abandoning the Wardens.

Well, I would, but like I said, the effort : earning ratio isn't really worth it. Maybe later, I dunno.

... See, you can tell I'm a Warden just by that.

Romulus sat, brooding, running a finger around the edge of the coffee cup, looking at the strategic map.  Here from his stronghold deep in the Netherlands, it was a more abstract exercise, of course.  Skirmishes were won and lost, and the battle front moved each day.  But the overall situation was clear. 

The Wardens had lost.  Pushed from their redoubts by the berserk Marauders, out-thought by the Sages--even their walls had been undermined by the Architects.  He shook his head at the indignity of it all.  It was over, or was soon to be over, which came to the same thing in the end.

One could be a lone hero, he supposed.  Great contests had been won, and tides had been turned on the strength of a single man holding a ragged standard, fighting for the dignity of an ancient house.  He looked out the window, across the tulip fields, a windmill turning and burning in the distance.

Soon, the dikes would be breached, and he could not hold his fingers in every hole.  He took the last sip of coffee and stood up.  He removed his armor and hung it up, slowly.  The great helm with the crest.  The breastplate with the "W" blazoned across it.  The traditional wooden shoes.   He lay his ancestral sword across the table and scrawled out a farewell message for those who came after him to find.

"Goodbye.  I leave on semi-indefinite hiatus.  Perhaps I shall return when the Wardens are most in need of me.  But until then, farewell."

 

 

This is beautiful.

Really sucks how you're not a Warden.

@Romulus

(Heck I just realized he's not as dead as we thought. Logged in just a couple days ago...)

Fine, I'll do it for Tim myself.

Romulus definitely had potential to be the best of the Wardens and carry us to, at the very least, one thousand commendations so we wouldn't be the laughingstocks of the site anymore. Still, through either real life commitments or lack of interest in the site, he disappeared, leaving everyone to assume he fell in Viking combat and as such is in Valhalla now. He couldn't have left at worse time either, because he had joined the EPIC Contest and would surely have carried us into greatness if he hadn't vanished so suddenly. Though one could say that I could have carried us into greatness too had I actually, y'know, wrote anything for it.

Sometimes I sit and wonder about how we could have ruled the site like the Sages do now. The best of the best, carried by the one called Romulus, who could have been a king had he not abandoned us so. He's a disgrace to the Wardens and most of all a disgrace to the site, and I find myself embarrassed each time I have to say his name. Which, given how many times I've said it in this post, I feel extremely embarrassed. But the show must go on and the SHAME must continue. So, where was I? Oh, yes, Romulus is a disgrace. He had so many good stories and so much raw potential, he could have several featured stories had he just applied himself! But nay, he felt the need to follow in his ancestors' footsteps, and as such has died. I hope he has found eternal battle and feasting in Valhalla, though a fool like him deserves no such victory.

Badaboom, there's your 250 (actually 277!) words, ya bastard.

Too late, b.

But thanks.

I know, but I wanted to carry you into glory, my dear friend.

I mostly agree with your breakdown except for a section of the storygame comment part. It does feel as if it's the easiest way to quickly accumulate comms, although I think far more effort goes into them than forum posts (or at least it should be that way). Depending on the story length, you have to actually read a lot especially if the "end game" links don't frequently appear. I do think it's easy to bullshit a comment and it can get featured if your large text block is next to comments like "lolz this gayme is gr8!", although there is no guarantee of a comm just for writing a long comment. Maybe I give the mods more power than they have, but I tend to think they can spot a comm whore by seeing what they've written. In the end we're all just sucking the mods' dicks trying to get the "of Avon" title and judging by the number of Sage comms, they've got quite the jaw cramp.

Jealous?

Well, I'm gonna have to rebuke by saying that, while you do have to read a lot more when making a comment, there's usually a basic structure to a review-type comment. Point out what you like, dislike, how the author can improve, etc. And, frankly, there just isn't a formula for the perfect forum post.

Not yet, anyway...

Plus, you also get points from comments, so that's even more reward for effort.

And, personally, I think it sorta has a lot to do with image.

When a mod commends a forum post or storygame, it says in big red letters "commended by [mod]" at the top. Now, a mod just can't go around commending every storygame or forum post that they like or agree with, because it sorta broadcasts to everyone that like "hey this mod liked this thing, so if you like this mod, then you'll probably like this". It's essentially sponsorship.

Comments, on the other hand, have pretty much total anonymity when it comes to which mod featured it. I'm pretty sure it's mainly End with his attention threads, but hey, there aren't any big red letters on the comment, so you can't tell.

Basically, I'm sure that the mods only commend posts and stories they especially like to not devalue their image and commendations in general by just handing them out.

But I mean, hey, I'm a Warden, I dunno.

Fair point. The fact is storygame comments are more valuable to the site and should be rewarded higher than forum posts. I don't mean to downplay the importance of an active forum, but the site is built upon around the actual publishing of CYOA stories. I can't speak for everyone, but I always read the comments and check the rating breakdown before playing a storygame to see if it's even worth it. I think a writing site should value publishing and reviewing stories above everything else.

I can't speak to a mod's decision to commend a post or not based on their name being attached to it. Perhaps a mod will graciously shed some light on the subject, although it's hard to go wrong with a creative rant or in-depth analysis of a short story. Just what I've noticed.

Yeah — I don’t see a commendation as more valuable or not based on the person’s name attached to it. In an ideal world, all admins work on the same standards.

Yeah like I said, it was more of a personal theory than hard fact, it's all just speculation really because I'm not a mod and I dunno what it's like.

Partly the reason why I didn't really include it in my main analysis, honestly. Didn't really have any evidence.

And yes, of course, this is a writing site, not just a forum. Commendations are mostly awarded to good writers and active critics, after all: Exactly the reason the Wardens are dead last.

@Gower just swiped your commendation, @Tim36D

If you want to get this post commended, you'll have to get @Romulus himself to post in this thread.

BREAKING NEWS: 3J Bullies Tim, The Confirmed Best Boy of CYS! What Has Become of Our Admins?

Is it bullying if the recipient is a Warden?

No, then it's justice.

It is if the Warden is Tim!

No bulli pls

Tim, to the Netherlands!

It's really tiny, just yell Romulus from the airport until he hears you.

As much as the commendation calls to me with it's allure, I'm gonna have to pass on flying to the Netherlands and hunting Romulus.

Guess I'll just hope he pops in.

Wardens are just so not dedicated. I hope the RNG god makes them weak again next time.

Well, at least most of us Wardens don't abandon the site for years at a time to buy cigarettes.

That seems like it would be more in character for a Marauder. The other Orders are supposed to be at home defending and building up the castle and writing and such. I think something really did go screwy with the RNG that first time, got all the fantasy horoscopes mixed up.

It would be cool to have a sorting hat for new users, but it would probably bias to one order or another and it would be way more work than it's worth.

It was a weird day, that summer's day, not so long ago. I was gazing across the barren tulip fields, where the spring's floral splendour had long since gone. I was contemplating something, though I can't quite remember what. (Funny how that happens more and more frequently these days. I might be getting old...)

I think it was something about the inevitable passing of time. How monuments crumble under the weight of ages. How once mighty orders might pass into the annals of history. How one might slowly forget about the bustling places of the past.

...Or I was thinking about lunch. Which I also happen to think about quite frequently these days. 

Anyhow, I remember that day because there was a certain something in the air. A warm breeze, a sultry gust of air that carressed the listless windmills, spinning faintly after years of disuse.

It was a most peculiar phenomenon because, as I stood there, listening; I could swear there was a voice that was calling me. Some average silly motherfucking voice that spoke of bets and commendations, and stuff. Or something like that. I can't quite remember. These random voice things happen a lot, it's quite a small country. 

---

Anyhow, I just happened to check out CYS again a couple of days ago. Glad (?) things didn't change too much. I'm a bit caught up in my newly-found adult life, so I won't probably become active again anytime soon. 

Thanks for stopping by, Romulus!  Awesome!

Thank you Romulus, very cool.

Oh heck I didn't even see this.

Great post, and glad to have you back even if it's just to say hi and bye.

Maybe there's still hope for Undr, if even Romulus can briefly live again after all this time.

I have just sent a Marauder ambassadorial invitation, complete with a wax seal and a ribbon, to Romulus, requesting that he present himself in this thread.

Marauder ambassadorial invitations are usually more blunt.  But we will see what fruit this kind letter bears.

What if each group had a mod assigned the designated leader?  That would certainly even things out a little, and it'd be funny to watch them compete with one another.

I suspect that would make it seem like it meant more than it did, when it is pretty clear that it is for the lols of it all.

I don't want to be in an actual competition with a death god from Detroit.

That does sound kinda dangerous, come to think of it...

The wardens have always been terrible. It wasn’t even that long ago that we had a sizeable chunk of the top 20 contributors with 0 comms. Disgustang.

I have a question. Why are the commendations given from storygames so varied? For example, Avery_Moore got 60 commendations for The Price of Freedom while Bill_Ingersoll got 35 and 45 commendations respectively for his stories. Your stories, Silver Horns, Silver Hooves and Agent of Order received 27 and 23 commendations respectively. Is there any real pattern that I'm not seeing or is it kind of like a random number machine?

It's based on the size of the story. These numbers will be increasing though.

Oh, that makes sense. Thank you very much for your quick response. 

That moment when just two Architects got more commendations in 2019 than the top three Wardens have got ever, an amount almost equal to half of all Warden commendations.

As of today, I'm the 3rd highest Architect at 158 comms... an entire storygame's worth of points more than the highest Warden.

And I've only been here since the end of April.

(Also, much thanks to the "Commendation Fairy" who visited me today and left 31 shiny new points under my pillow!)

DAMMIT, MIZAL
I'll catch up again though.

Fair warning: I do expect to have one more storygame published this fall. That will be worth another 30 or so, perhaps.

I consider topping Ogre11 to be an unattainable goal. However, if I can find a henchman willing to smash Will11's computer to pieces so he can't publish another story this year, I just might pop into the #2 spot...

Not that I'm cutthroat or anything.

The relative weighting of storygames is going to increase, including retroactively... it will be interesting.

Brb writing my epic

Something is wrong when I can become the fourth ranked Warden by writing two games and a comment

Looks like my brothers in arms have failed. This truly is sad.

You should change that. Having micropenis in their top five would suit them well.

Lol.

With articles factored in:

• 1,650 Commendations for Architects
• 1,778 Commendations for Marauders
• 2,248 Commendations for Sages
• 666 Commendations for Wardens

More changes to commendations coming in subsequent updates.

Worst order ever.

"One of the scouts has returned, my lord," the sentry said, his voice trembling. The General was not the sort of man who liked to be disturbed, particularly not when he was about to go to bed, and most especially not when his bed contained a lovely young woman with hair like fire and a body whose tantalizing curves had made her stand out from the hundreds of others who followed the great army.

The General spat. It was an inconvenience, but business before pleasure. He took a swig from the flask at his hip and then nodded. "Send him in." He turned to the girl with a crooked smile. "It'll only be a minute, love."

The scout came inside the tent and stood shivering, a scraggly beard hanging limp from his chin. The General hardly noticed the expression on his face. He was used to inspiring fear, whether in his enemies or his subordinates, and so as the man simply stood, shivering in silence, the General was not surprised. "Out with it," he barked after a while, and when the scout still didn't respond, he added "Or I'll tear that dirty rag from your face and stuff it down your throat."

"They...they're out there," he said at last.

His voice was quiet, and the General stalked closer. "Who's out there? Speak, boy!"

The scout didn't seem to see him, and the General noticed that his eyes were glazed over. "They're out there," he said again. "And they're coming."

He had seen this kind of terror before, a fear far different from the common worries about battle or the anxiety of losing comrades. Once, long again and in a different war, when the General was just a junior officer, they had taken an enemy camp, a prison fortress that held those unlucky souls that the enemy had captured. The General was not naive. He knew the terrible tortures that those men had undergone, how they had watched the enemy brutalize their friends and how they had been treated as less than animals. More than anything else, that was what had convinced him to be a warrior, to lead men in the defense of his people from the scum that would destroy them.

Those prisoners had the same glazed over eyes as this scout, and so when the General spoke again, he had none of his usual hostility. "Who were they? How many are there?"

"They're coming," the man repeated. "We don't stand a chance."

The General spat again. "I'd like to see the army that can take this fort."

The scout shook his head and then suddenly grabbed his arm. "You don't understand! They're out there, and they're coming! We need to run. We need to find a place, a safe place far away, somewhere where they can't hurt us!" He sank to his knees, and when he looked up he was sobbing. "The Wardens."

It could not be true, and yet there the man lay, writhing on the ground, his voice now only indistinct begging to be allowed to flee. They had been gone for so long that they were almost forgotten. Sensible people dismissed them as a mere fable, but the look in the scout's eyes was all too real. "You've done well, son."

Best to prepare for the worst, and, if the man was right, it would be very bad indeed. The General took another swig from his flask and glanced back at the gorgeous girl in his bed. "Sorry love. This will have to wait. The Wardens are coming."

Great story. I'm sure you'll help Chris get to 1000 comms.

And then you'll only be in last place by 650.

Several hours later, the General lay back, exhausted, spent, fully pleasured.  The flask had been upended somehow, and dripped moderately-acceptable wine on the floor.  The gorgeous girl lay in dazed half-sleep, one breast exposed outside the white linen sheet, smiling slightly.  She opened her eyes, looking for a drink.  "Did you like it?" she said, touching his chest.

"Right, right, you've done well, girl," said the general.

"So, am I dismissed, or..." said the scout, shuffling his feet, as he still stood in the door.

"Oh, Fendrick, are you still there?," said the General, getting up, toweling off, and sitting in his camp chair.  "Report."

"Well, like I said, the Wardens are coming.  Totally coming.  You seemed like you were about to do something about it.  We need to retreat.  We need to set a rear guard and see if we can penetrate their lines from..."  Fendrick the scout looked down as the General and the gorgeous girl shared a look.  Fendrick suddenly couldn't think of any military action that didn't sound like a euphemism.  Flanking action.  They're right on top of us.  Their forces are potent and coming immediately.  He shook his head.

"Uh-huh.  No, I heard you."

"We must prepare!"

"Right, find a place, a safe place far away, somewhere where they can't hurt us.  Like I said earlier.  You said the Wardens, right?"

"Yes!  Yes!"

A young herald-in-training ran into the room with a requisition form.  "For you, general."

"Let's see.  Yes.  Yes.  Mm-hm.  Very good.  I'll speak to the quartermaster."

"Everything correctly done?" the herald asked eagerly.

"Right, right, you've done well, son," the General said automatically.  "Very good, very important work you're doing."

The herald ran out, and then the General sighed, crumpled up the requisition form and throw it on the ground.  "Boy gets everything wrong.  I just try to make him feel as if he's doing something important.  Get kicked in the head by a mule when he was younger.

Fendrick stepped back.  "Should I gather the captains together to prepare for the coming of the Wardens."

The General picked up a bottle of wine and held it up to the light.  He was still nude.  "The thing about Old Graymalkin is that the odd numbered vintages need serious decanting.  Why would that be?  What are they doing in those odd years that there's so much sediment?"  He opened the bottle and decanted it slowly.  "What were you saying."

"The Wardens, sir!"

"Oh, I'll take care of that.  Very serious.  Very serious stuff.  Right, right, you've done well, son.  Medals and commedations and so forth.  Why don't you run along and let me think about strategy and how to put into practice this very important information."  He continued decanting his wine.  "Wardens," he said quietly, under his breath, and trying not to spill the wine as he laughed.

 

An improvement in realism.

I laughed out loud at work right around the kicked in the head by a mule line, and not in the usual 'i smirked a little and typed lol on my phone' kind of way.

This one was impossible to explain to anyone around me, as all the best funny things are.

Hey, I know this is a dead subject, but I just wanted to mention: There are so few people in Wardens actually doing anything that Jamescoker is still in the top 20. Jamescoker. And he's not even at the bottom, either. He's only 6 commendations away from beating Romulus.

6 commendations away from being the same status as the guy that the Wardens called to for help! He was banned years ago, and this is still the case! And to give you all a better idea of the sheer scale available here, he's also only four points above the people on the absolute bottom. A dedicated few day's worth of commendations, at most, and you basically have a free ride to the top ten. Put a week of effort into it, and you'll take up the last space in the top 5, and eliminate Bendy from- Wait a second, I'm sorry, who the fuck is Bendy?

Oh, right, he wrote a single storygame! Which is good! But also, nothing else. Yes, that action alone propelled Bendy The Speechless into realms of magnificence that would be occupied by TharaApples, Ebonvasilis, AND FUCKING AVERY MOORE if it had been a more motivated faction. And just to show you how horrible this situation is, the people above Bendy ARE SO MANY MILES AHEAD OF EVERYONE ON THAT LEADERBOARD. Now, normally this isn't an issue. We're not a big website, right? So huge commendation discrepancies are common in all leaderboards. 

Sages and Architects have a pretty even spread, but notice how big a dropoff there is at 8th place. For the marauders? There's not even a dropoff until 13th place. But for a newbie trying to make their way up the ranks as a Warden? You aren't gonna hit a roadblock until you're already in the top 5. Not to say that there isn't a challenge to get higher after that, in fact everybody above bendy has more than twice the commendations I do, but this is a little bit excessive and I've spent far too long thinking about it

Serpent's alt is already in the top 20.

And I've only done three comed storygame reviews

 

E: Seems im no longer in the top 20. Just need to write 2 more reviews then

Not anymore. SindriV is their new champ.

Wow! It's like we actually have a more realistic representation of the wardens now that all their past achievements are brought into the limelight. It's like making fun of Canada until a WWII historian in the back steps forward

MY REIGN. MY GLORIOUS REIGN OVER THE DIRT-PEOPLE, TOPPLING IN A MOMENT.

E: Oh hey thanks for the comms for the updated Frameshift- spent longer on rehashing it than I did writing the original so that’s nice. Guess I’ll just have to write more stories to keep up.

Dang. Also pushed out of the top 20 while I wasn't looking.

(Not that it's a very high bar, anyway)

Time to accept defeat.

And the Sages are now led by Steve who also has the second greatest number of commendations overall.

Great job guys. Lol.

I thought...there was an understanding....that no one was going to mention that....

He hasn't been around much, we've still got time to fix this before he notices.